Training a barrel and Heeling horse

EquineAlberta · 09-02-2008, 01:47 PM

I have two horses that just came for some training for a lady who lives over 3 hours a way. She is a professional rider but had a bad riding accident 4 months ago, and so decided to send these two to me as I trained one of her babies for someone else recently. Let me be clear, she KNOWS the I ride english only (although I will put a horse in a western saddle for a client once they have the basics...western saddles scare me) so she isn't expecting me to be a western expect by any means, but I figure some info from you guys migth help me out.

So, one of them hasn't been started at all, and her eventual role is to be a barrel horse. So far, she is easy to deal with for her ground work.

the other one is destined to be a heeling horse. This guy has some riding, but is terrified of so many things (like ropes, being touched, having his legs touched) so that is most of my focus right now.

Is there anything I should keep in mind, or work on that is specific to either of these horse's eventual roles?

Karen

vetjeanne · 09-02-2008, 01:57 PM

Both horses need to work off their hind end, a good stop and be able to crawl up under their bellyies. Really just a broke horse, my best heel horses were reining horses that didn't make it.

**gbarmranch** · 09-02-2008, 01:58 PM

I completely agree.. and if you can get some access to cattle, you can also practise tracking them with the heel horse.. lots of fun too

DoBeSassy · 09-02-2008, 01:58 PM

Some people may not agree with me, but I you should be fine teaching the barrel horse the basics like you would any other horse. Plenty of circles.

Something you could do, is get a DVD from Martha Josey or someone, to get an idea of how they are trained from a professional.

As for the rope horse, I think I would go back to the ground and sack him out really well again. That would be most beneficial to him it seems. Then just introduce him to as many things as possible.

From my experience riding while my dad roped, he needs to be able to back into a box(so he can't be scared to put his butt against the box), he should be comfortable with the rope on ALL parts of his body. I have seen the rope go under the tail even. And he is going to come in contact with a calf at some point, so he can't be afraid of other animals in his personal space.

TLCowgirl3597 · 09-02-2008, 03:24 PM

I train both of these disciplines...of course everything you would do with any other horse...get em' real broke.
The barrel horse:concentrate a bunch on bending at the rib, breaking at the pole, giving that nose real easy, counterflexing, make sure when doing circles their shoulder isn't dropping, and driving off the hind end with everything they do, don't let em' kick that hind end out, drive em' up.
The Heel horse:Needs to be desensitized to EVERYTHING, ropes, cattle, noises, other horses, dogs, has to be in between your legs real good, back with little or no rein, be able to stand & relax in or out of the box for extended periods, needs a solid stop(not on the front end). Drag tires or anything heavy you can off of em' to prep em' form the feel of that weight. With a rope horse alot of their best learinin' is done trackin' cattle & helpin' move cattle, run chutes at practice ropin's so see if you can take em' down to a local deal & just help out(it's good for all colts brains to do all of this stuff).

P.S. I wouldn't wanna switch shoes with ya'....That postage stamp doesn't have much to grab if one goes to pitchin'...

I'd rather ride bareback than have a smidge of a saddle to tease me. Good luck!

pasopony · 09-02-2008, 04:23 PM

You want to spend some time teaching the barrel horse to bend around your leg and move off of your legs very easily. They also need to be able to take correct leads and do flying lead changes for the pattern. As everyone has said, using the hind end is very important. Lots of circles drilling up and down at different speeds (spiralling) so the horse can learn to rate himself in turns. Flexibility to bend around the barrels is important too - the horse needs to give his head easily and follow it willingly.

A J · 09-03-2008, 08:27 AM

I agree with pretty much everything said here. Starting out, there's not really anything different, just some things to really make sure they are doing well.

EquineAlberta · 09-03-2008, 04:03 PM

I didn't know if there were certain cues each type of horse would need to know that might be different.

My focus on the heeler is desensitizing right now. he is so jumpy and nervous about everything. Pretty sure he has scars from being roped (the rescued him...he was terrified when they took him to watch their good horses rope), so today I took two plastic bottles, filled wiht a little sand (to rattle) tied them at either end of some bailing twine, and swung those around and over them...that was exciting.

DoBeSassy, Backing into a box is something he can work on that should be less terrifying for him that I hadn't thought of(I don't want to worry him every training session!).

Karen

Crookedblaze · 09-03-2008, 04:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vetjeanne

Both horses need to work off their hind end, a good stop and be able to crawl up under their bellyies. Really just a broke horse, my best heel horses were reining horses that didn't make it.

All of the ropers at the ranch that my mom used to manage has roping horses that were reining horses that didn't make it, also.

For a barrel horse, I'd start working on bending/flexing, it really helps in the turn.

Red Gate Farm · 09-03-2008, 04:10 PM

I agree with all the responses here and add this...

Don't be afraid to tell the lady if the horse just isn't cut out for what she wants it to do. It's best to know this before investing a lot more money into training for a horse who's just not suitable for barrel racing or penning (or any discipline for that matter).

AlbertaGirl · 09-03-2008, 04:13 PM

One other thing I could think of is that a barrel horse or heeler will both likely be wearing breast collars and back cinches as well, so all the desensitzing you can do in those ares would probably be good for them. If you do ride them with a western saddle, maybe use both if you can

TLCowgirl3597 · 09-04-2008, 04:06 PM

Didn't think of that....not having breast collars & cinches for me is like...not wearing a bra...Not something I'd think twice about....

. But yeah that's definetly something they'll need exposed to.
To prep for a backcinch on the ground I take a leadrope wrap it under the belly & rub it bounce it on the belly etc....until there is no reaction. Just part of the program...
Another method I've seen is in the roundpen I've seen Dennis Reis put a rope on em' & pull on it while they're loping until there's no reaction & they'll turn & face him....but my way works for me...

EquineAlberta · 09-05-2008, 10:54 AM

The gelding has been roped in the past (has scars on his neck to prove it), so I am mostly working on getting him used to ropes and things swinging around him as he is terrified!

I don't have a round pen anymore, so no round pen work possible.

I can put a breast collar on him even with my english saddle (well, a breastplate, but should be the same, so thanks for that idea!), but I don't own a back cinch...although I suppose I could tie a tensor bandage or something back there and use some twine to connect it to the front cinch/girth.

Of course I can't even get on him yet...I can lean across his back, but when I went to actually mount he left me on my bum. This horse is jumpy and FAST, but not mean thank goodness.

Karen

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09-02-2008, 01:47 PM
EquineAlberta Seasoned Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Alberta, Canada Posts: 4,470	Training a barrel and Heeling horse I have two horses that just came for some training for a lady who lives over 3 hours a way. She is a professional rider but had a bad riding accident 4 months ago, and so decided to send these two to me as I trained one of her babies for someone else recently. Let me be clear, she KNOWS the I ride english only (although I will put a horse in a western saddle for a client once they have the basics...western saddles scare me) so she isn't expecting me to be a western expect by any means, but I figure some info from you guys migth help me out. So, one of them hasn't been started at all, and her eventual role is to be a barrel horse. So far, she is easy to deal with for her ground work. the other one is destined to be a heeling horse. This guy has some riding, but is terrified of so many things (like ropes, being touched, having his legs touched) so that is most of my focus right now. Is there anything I should keep in mind, or work on that is specific to either of these horse's eventual roles? Karen __________________ Hillside Stable, Ardrossan, AB Do unto others as you would have them do unto you...is it really that hard?

09-02-2008, 01:57 PM
vetjeanne Halter broke Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: arkansas Posts: 55	Both horses need to work off their hind end, a good stop and be able to crawl up under their bellyies. Really just a broke horse, my best heel horses were reining horses that didn't make it. __________________ I will lift up mine eyes unto the hills... www.arkyhorse.com Last edited by vetjeanne : 09-02-2008 at 04:24 PM.

09-02-2008, 01:58 PM
gbarmranch Administrator Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Tennessee Posts: 29,233	I completely agree.. and if you can get some access to cattle, you can also practise tracking them with the heel horse.. lots of fun too __________________ Quality FoundationQuarter Horses http://home.earthlink.net/~vpgann Minds are like parachutes – they only function when open – Thomas Dewar

09-02-2008, 01:58 PM
DoBeSassy Seasoned Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Texas Posts: 4,966	Some people may not agree with me, but I you should be fine teaching the barrel horse the basics like you would any other horse. Plenty of circles. Something you could do, is get a DVD from Martha Josey or someone, to get an idea of how they are trained from a professional. As for the rope horse, I think I would go back to the ground and sack him out really well again. That would be most beneficial to him it seems. Then just introduce him to as many things as possible. From my experience riding while my dad roped, he needs to be able to back into a box(so he can't be scared to put his butt against the box), he should be comfortable with the rope on ALL parts of his body. I have seen the rope go under the tail even. And he is going to come in contact with a calf at some point, so he can't be afraid of other animals in his personal space. __________________ There is none so blind as she who will not see

09-02-2008, 03:24 PM
TLCowgirl3597 Weanling Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Pahrump,NV Posts: 255	I train both of these disciplines...of course everything you would do with any other horse...get em' real broke. The barrel horse:concentrate a bunch on bending at the rib, breaking at the pole, giving that nose real easy, counterflexing, make sure when doing circles their shoulder isn't dropping, and driving off the hind end with everything they do, don't let em' kick that hind end out, drive em' up. The Heel horse:Needs to be desensitized to EVERYTHING, ropes, cattle, noises, other horses, dogs, has to be in between your legs real good, back with little or no rein, be able to stand & relax in or out of the box for extended periods, needs a solid stop(not on the front end). Drag tires or anything heavy you can off of em' to prep em' form the feel of that weight. With a rope horse alot of their best learinin' is done trackin' cattle & helpin' move cattle, run chutes at practice ropin's so see if you can take em' down to a local deal & just help out(it's good for all colts brains to do all of this stuff). P.S. I wouldn't wanna switch shoes with ya'....That postage stamp doesn't have much to grab if one goes to pitchin'... I'd rather ride bareback than have a smidge of a saddle to tease me. Good luck! __________________ Live everyday* as if it's your last, one of these days it just might be....*

09-02-2008, 04:23 PM
pasopony Yearling Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 820	You want to spend some time teaching the barrel horse to bend around your leg and move off of your legs very easily. They also need to be able to take correct leads and do flying lead changes for the pattern. As everyone has said, using the hind end is very important. Lots of circles drilling up and down at different speeds (spiralling) so the horse can learn to rate himself in turns. Flexibility to bend around the barrels is important too - the horse needs to give his head easily and follow it willingly. __________________ Horses are not my whole life, but horses make my life whole.

09-03-2008, 08:27 AM
A J Greenbroke Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Vallejo, CA Posts: 3,356	I agree with pretty much everything said here. Starting out, there's not really anything different, just some things to really make sure they are doing well. __________________ Try not, do. Do or do not. There is no try.

09-03-2008, 04:03 PM
EquineAlberta Seasoned Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Alberta, Canada Posts: 4,470	I didn't know if there were certain cues each type of horse would need to know that might be different. My focus on the heeler is desensitizing right now. he is so jumpy and nervous about everything. Pretty sure he has scars from being roped (the rescued him...he was terrified when they took him to watch their good horses rope), so today I took two plastic bottles, filled wiht a little sand (to rattle) tied them at either end of some bailing twine, and swung those around and over them...that was exciting. DoBeSassy, Backing into a box is something he can work on that should be less terrifying for him that I hadn't thought of(I don't want to worry him every training session!). Karen __________________ Hillside Stable, Ardrossan, AB Do unto others as you would have them do unto you...is it really that hard?

09-03-2008, 04:10 PM
Red Gate Farm Long Yearling Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Alberta, Canada Posts: 1,003	I agree with all the responses here and add this... Don't be afraid to tell the lady if the horse just isn't cut out for what she wants it to do. It's best to know this before investing a lot more money into training for a horse who's just not suitable for barrel racing or penning (or any discipline for that matter). __________________ Wendi "Humans is sneaky" - Scotty

09-03-2008, 04:13 PM
AlbertaGirl Greenbroke Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Alberta Posts: 3,312	One other thing I could think of is that a barrel horse or heeler will both likely be wearing breast collars and back cinches as well, so all the desensitzing you can do in those ares would probably be good for them. If you do ride them with a western saddle, maybe use both if you can __________________ Some people say horses don't have a sense of humor... they obviously haven't met mine yet ;o)

09-04-2008, 04:06 PM
TLCowgirl3597 Weanling Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Pahrump,NV Posts: 255	Didn't think of that....not having breast collars & cinches for me is like...not wearing a bra...Not something I'd think twice about..... But yeah that's definetly something they'll need exposed to. To prep for a backcinch on the ground I take a leadrope wrap it under the belly & rub it bounce it on the belly etc....until there is no reaction. Just part of the program... Another method I've seen is in the roundpen I've seen Dennis Reis put a rope on em' & pull on it while they're loping until there's no reaction & they'll turn & face him....but my way works for me... __________________ Live everyday* as if it's your last, one of these days it just might be....*

09-05-2008, 10:54 AM
EquineAlberta Seasoned Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Alberta, Canada Posts: 4,470	The gelding has been roped in the past (has scars on his neck to prove it), so I am mostly working on getting him used to ropes and things swinging around him as he is terrified! I don't have a round pen anymore, so no round pen work possible. I can put a breast collar on him even with my english saddle (well, a breastplate, but should be the same, so thanks for that idea!), but I don't own a back cinch...although I suppose I could tie a tensor bandage or something back there and use some twine to connect it to the front cinch/girth. Of course I can't even get on him yet...I can lean across his back, but when I went to actually mount he left me on my bum. This horse is jumpy and FAST, but not mean thank goodness. Karen __________________ Hillside Stable, Ardrossan, AB Do unto others as you would have them do unto you...is it really that hard?