Amish Horse Training-your views on it...

AQHBarrelRacer · 01-22-2008, 08:01 PM

I don't know what made me think of this, but I'm curious on everyones views and experiances with Amish training. Up here, in Western New York, it's pretty popular. Amish charge $50-100 to train a horse, per month. So whether someone is broke, or just wants to take the troubled horse to get straightened out, they are there.

Figured it would be an interested discussion

calicocalgirl · 01-22-2008, 08:05 PM

Belleville PA is a big amish town! Well small town, mostly amish.
I have seen some good amish trainers and some bad, just like any other.
Some take excellent care of their horses, some horrible care.
I think it's just like checking out any other kind of trainer. Find out how they care for them, what they do to train them, see if you can talk to others who sent horses. Cheap isnt always good, sometimes you get what you pay for.. but in the case of the Amish , some of these kids just love to ride horses and really do a good job.

calicocalgirl · 01-22-2008, 08:08 PM

I also think that when people hear Amish they think they will be unkind and just work the horses to death and not care about them.

I have one Amish customer that every couple weeks comes in and buys 4- 25lb bags of treats for his horses and a couple bottles of showsheen. Some of them really take pride in their horses and do treat them as good if not better than the rest of us.

AQHBarrelRacer · 01-22-2008, 08:10 PM

I agree.
I have some great Amish "friends" and have used some as farriers in the past. But once gas went up, just wasn't worth hauling.

Palomino06 · 01-22-2008, 08:19 PM

In my opinion, Amish trainers are just like any other trainer. Some are good, some are bad, you have to do a little investigating and work before you chose one. My pony, and two of my horses were trained by Amish guys. They all did wonderful jobs, and took good care of my horses. The QH I used to own was a real difficult horse, and we sent him to a few different Amish trainers. The last place he was at took really good care of him. He was good at his job, and just generally loved being around horses. The Amish man that I bought my QH mare, Layla, from is a very great horseman. You could tell that he loves his horses. He's the type of person I'd have train all my horses if I could. He's great with the horses and great to the horses.

I also use an Amish man to trim feet when I can't get a regular farrier. Since I don't show or shoe my horses, he works just fine. And only charges me $5 a hoof!

RollingThunder · 01-22-2008, 08:28 PM

While I do not personally know any Amish people, much less horsemen, I can say that what I have seen at breed expos and on TV of their horsemanship, they have very quiet, calm, mellow horses, and they take great care to make sure they are turned out correctly, their harnesses and tack are exemplary and in good order.

I don't think it's a matter of pride to these folks, I think it's a matter of good stewardship to them. Taking proper care of an animal, to many, is simply what you are supposed to do. When they read in the good book "Go forth and subdue the earth" they didn't take that to mean "Crush the critters." It's like I always said when I fostered and trained greyhounds off the track, and people would ask if they were beaten or starved. Beaten animals don't run well, and starved animals won't run at all.

A good trainer knows this, and acts accordingly.

Equine Kneads · 01-22-2008, 09:17 PM

I would never send my horse to an amish trainer...

The amish in general view horses much differently...they are usually a 'means' to them and it seems as a whole their education is limited. There are so many more options for you!

Always, explore them and get references...watch their training and make surprise visits! I would not trust anyone w/my horse 100%..I have heard of too many stories that horses were not treated correctly.

dreamer1 · 01-22-2008, 09:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by calicocalgirl

Belleville PA is a big amish town! Well small town, mostly amish.
I have seen some good amish trainers and some bad, just like any other.
Some take excellent care of their horses, some horrible care.
I think it's just like checking out any other kind of trainer. Find out how they care for them, what they do to train them, see if you can talk to others who sent horses. Cheap isnt always good, sometimes you get what you pay for.. but in the case of the Amish , some of these kids just love to ride horses and really do a good job.

I have to agree w/you 100%.

rubysmom · 01-22-2008, 09:35 PM

I owned a belgian who had been owned by the Amish and his tongue had a huge cut in it from his training. I also had a friend whos horse had been tied to a tree for three days no food, no water. They said this would make him mind. On the other side, my friend lets different amish use his horses for plowing to keep them in shape. They are awesome with his horses. Just like they all said, There are good and bad trainers. Pick carefully.

AQHBarrelRacer · 01-22-2008, 09:45 PM

Interesting to see everyones views, I figured it would be

I personally train my own horses, I don't trust many people, so very picky. Easier to train my own, 99% of the time that is

I'll tell ya one thing, I do know a guy who wanted to buy a Draft mare from some Amish buy us, he told them he'd be back in 3 days to buy her, he came back 4 days later instead, she was hanging from a tree, skinned

I was disguisted.

However, I do know some good Amish out there. There is good and bad within every group, just got to research before choosing within any trainer, farrier, vet, etc.

sugarsgal · 01-22-2008, 10:03 PM

Like mentioned already..There are good and bad no matter if they are Amish, Mononites or whatever.

I've seen horrible Mononite situations where the horses were injured, poorly groomed, skinny, feet over grown and no care was taken for lack of knowledge and 1 hour away the horse's were like their family. Very well Groomed, well fed, well behaved, friendly and feet were nice.

Obviously if I were to send my Own horse there I would definatly judge on how their horses looked first. My sister did send one out to a Menonite and they were concerned for her baby (we we not sure if she was pregant when she was sent) so they called for us to pick her up. She wasn't even due for another 4 months. But what they did was amazing, she looked better than when she left and was friendly (never handled at last owners place) She rode like a charm for only being there 2 months and left untame.

Their methods are a bit odd though. The my sister used, used a Large stuffed animals as person instead of risking his own life to break the horse. Once the horse accepted the stuffed toy the kids actually rode the horse up and down the roads

WarpaintsMom · 01-22-2008, 10:05 PM

I am sure there are good Amish trainers out there however I have yet to meet one. A mare I bought last summer had gone to the amish a few months before I purchased her to get her shoes done when she wouldn't stand still they put a metal face mask on her that had spikes on the underside (which ended up damaging her nasial bone and making it difficult for her to breath) and when that didn't work they drove a shoe nail up through her frog which wasn't found til the next day!

Where they beat her legs she has permanent damage and understandably won't let very many people near her feet. Such a ruin of a fantastic horse definately wasn't worth the $10 they paid to have her done

So I shudder to think of their under saddle training techniques.

beezwing · 01-23-2008, 07:48 AM

There are jerks of all religions, creeds, and lifestyles. Affiliation with one form of church does not make one a good or bad horse trainer, the soul and brain you use while training does. When you "use" horses for you work and transportation you would be less sentimental about them.

and it is Mennonite..btw

k

talkofthetown4eva · 01-23-2008, 07:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by beezwing

There are jerks of all religions, creeds, and lifestyles. Affiliation with one form of church does not make one a good or bad horse trainer, the soul and brain you use while training does. When you "use" horses for you work and transportation you would be less sentimental about them.

and it is Mennonite..btw

k

Very well put, beezwing.

99horses · 01-23-2008, 07:56 AM

We live near a large Amish community and my farrier is a Amish man, my tack comes from the Amish as does alot of my produce that I buy. I have met many that are great with the horses and take the best care of them. We have also met a few I wouldn't trust my worst enemy with. You just have to pick carefully just like with any other trainer. My experinces have been very good with them

HorseLvr76 · 01-23-2008, 07:59 AM

I agree with many of the comments that it is based on the individual, and not the religious group stereotype. I have heard and seen many bad things from some Amish, and yet I train for an Amish breeder that has beautiful horses, his barn is immaculate, and he is so quiet and calm with his horses it is amazing!

There are bad good and bad trainers, just like there are good and bad people, regardless of race, religion, etc...You just have to research anyone you are interested in having train your horse.

alliebath · 01-23-2008, 08:38 AM

We have an Amish "friend" who has done farrier work for us and we also bought a horse from him. We have also pleasure ridden with he and his brother, and even had dinner with he, his wife and two children while we were horse camping close to their home. Charming, delightful people. Would I send my horse to him? No. The horses I have seen them ride have had open sores where equipment has rubbed them, the barn is very deep in manure - and the horse that we bought from him was a problem horse. Not this guys fault, he bought him at a sale and knew nothing about him - when we contacted him about the problems and advice on fixing them - he told my fiance that he would take him back and work on the problem - that he would either fix the problem or break the horse. The method he said he would use to fix him, in my own opinion, was abusive. We did not send the horse, and in fact sold the horse - with FULL disclosure of the problems. Another friend sent a horse to have some miles put on her and was very happy with the training. So much depends on the individual person, horse and issue.

ahlihaff · 01-23-2008, 08:43 AM

As others have stated, there are good and not so good trainers of every kind.

One friend had her friendly, happy horse to an Amish trainer. She got him back with a completely different disposition. He was trained all right, but he was a robot - no "soul", no personality. Another one's horse came to her from an Amish trainer as friendly and happy as can be.

I do agree with Equine Kneads that the Amish view their horses differently than we do - a means to an end.

calicocalgirl · 01-23-2008, 12:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rubysmom

I owned a belgian who had been owned by the Amish and his tongue had a huge cut in it from his training. I also had a friend whos horse had been tied to a tree for three days no food, no water. They said this would make him mind. On the other side, my friend lets different amish use his horses for plowing to keep them in shape. They are awesome with his horses. Just like they all said, There are good and bad trainers. Pick carefully.

I had a western pleasure mare before that came from an immaculate place, her tongue had been sliced.
I have seen WP trainers tie their horses heads to the side or up in the air for hours.
People can pick cruel incidences from Amish trainers, but you can also pick them from other trainers as well.
There are good and bad in all.

pippy · 01-23-2008, 12:43 PM

Here in MN there are several Amish communities. I've heard good things and bad things about Amish trainers. I know some that send their horses to them to be trained for pulling a buggy, when the horse comes back, it definitely knows what it's doing & respect. I don't know anyone that has sent them to an Amish trainer to be trained for riding purposes.
I guess it's not worse then non Amish trainers- some are good, some aren't.

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01-22-2008, 08:01 PM
AQHBarrelRacer Coming two Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 1,623	Amish Horse Training-your views on it... I don't know what made me think of this, but I'm curious on everyones views and experiances with Amish training. Up here, in Western New York, it's pretty popular. Amish charge $50-100 to train a horse, per month. So whether someone is broke, or just wants to take the troubled horse to get straightened out, they are there. Figured it would be an interested discussion

01-22-2008, 08:05 PM
calicocalgirl Greenbroke Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: inbetweenhere&there, Pa Posts: 3,464	Belleville PA is a big amish town! Well small town, mostly amish. I have seen some good amish trainers and some bad, just like any other. Some take excellent care of their horses, some horrible care. I think it's just like checking out any other kind of trainer. Find out how they care for them, what they do to train them, see if you can talk to others who sent horses. Cheap isnt always good, sometimes you get what you pay for.. but in the case of the Amish , some of these kids just love to ride horses and really do a good job.

01-22-2008, 08:08 PM
calicocalgirl Greenbroke Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: inbetweenhere&there, Pa Posts: 3,464	I also think that when people hear Amish they think they will be unkind and just work the horses to death and not care about them. I have one Amish customer that every couple weeks comes in and buys 4- 25lb bags of treats for his horses and a couple bottles of showsheen. Some of them really take pride in their horses and do treat them as good if not better than the rest of us.

01-22-2008, 08:10 PM
AQHBarrelRacer Coming two Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 1,623	I agree. I have some great Amish "friends" and have used some as farriers in the past. But once gas went up, just wasn't worth hauling.

01-22-2008, 08:19 PM
Palomino06 Weanling Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Ontario Posts: 382	In my opinion, Amish trainers are just like any other trainer. Some are good, some are bad, you have to do a little investigating and work before you chose one. My pony, and two of my horses were trained by Amish guys. They all did wonderful jobs, and took good care of my horses. The QH I used to own was a real difficult horse, and we sent him to a few different Amish trainers. The last place he was at took really good care of him. He was good at his job, and just generally loved being around horses. The Amish man that I bought my QH mare, Layla, from is a very great horseman. You could tell that he loves his horses. He's the type of person I'd have train all my horses if I could. He's great with the horses and great to the horses. I also use an Amish man to trim feet when I can't get a regular farrier. Since I don't show or shoe my horses, he works just fine. And only charges me $5 a hoof! __________________ \"If horses knew their strength, we should not ride anymore.\" - Mark Twain \"You cannot train a horse with shouts and expect it to obey a whisper.\" - Dagobert D. Runes

01-22-2008, 08:28 PM
RollingThunder Halter broke Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Princeville, IL Posts: 128	While I do not personally know any Amish people, much less horsemen, I can say that what I have seen at breed expos and on TV of their horsemanship, they have very quiet, calm, mellow horses, and they take great care to make sure they are turned out correctly, their harnesses and tack are exemplary and in good order. I don't think it's a matter of pride to these folks, I think it's a matter of good stewardship to them. Taking proper care of an animal, to many, is simply what you are supposed to do. When they read in the good book "Go forth and subdue the earth" they didn't take that to mean "Crush the critters." It's like I always said when I fostered and trained greyhounds off the track, and people would ask if they were beaten or starved. Beaten animals don't run well, and starved animals won't run at all. A good trainer knows this, and acts accordingly. __________________ "I mean, with Jose Feliciano, you got no complaints."

01-22-2008, 09:17 PM
Equine Kneads Weanling Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: New Jersey Posts: 251	I would never send my horse to an amish trainer... The amish in general view horses much differently...they are usually a 'means' to them and it seems as a whole their education is limited. There are so many more options for you! Always, explore them and get references...watch their training and make surprise visits! I would not trust anyone w/my horse 100%..I have heard of too many stories that horses were not treated correctly. __________________ "The mind is like a parachute, it works best when open"- author unk www.EquineKneadsLLC.com

01-22-2008, 09:35 PM
rubysmom Weanling Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: michigan Posts: 213	I owned a belgian who had been owned by the Amish and his tongue had a huge cut in it from his training. I also had a friend whos horse had been tied to a tree for three days no food, no water. They said this would make him mind. On the other side, my friend lets different amish use his horses for plowing to keep them in shape. They are awesome with his horses. Just like they all said, There are good and bad trainers. Pick carefully.

01-22-2008, 09:45 PM
AQHBarrelRacer Coming two Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 1,623	Interesting to see everyones views, I figured it would be I personally train my own horses, I don't trust many people, so very picky. Easier to train my own, 99% of the time that is I'll tell ya one thing, I do know a guy who wanted to buy a Draft mare from some Amish buy us, he told them he'd be back in 3 days to buy her, he came back 4 days later instead, she was hanging from a tree, skinned I was disguisted. However, I do know some good Amish out there. There is good and bad within every group, just got to research before choosing within any trainer, farrier, vet, etc.

01-22-2008, 10:03 PM
sugarsgal Started Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 2,750	Like mentioned already..There are good and bad no matter if they are Amish, Mononites or whatever. I've seen horrible Mononite situations where the horses were injured, poorly groomed, skinny, feet over grown and no care was taken for lack of knowledge and 1 hour away the horse's were like their family. Very well Groomed, well fed, well behaved, friendly and feet were nice. Obviously if I were to send my Own horse there I would definatly judge on how their horses looked first. My sister did send one out to a Menonite and they were concerned for her baby (we we not sure if she was pregant when she was sent) so they called for us to pick her up. She wasn't even due for another 4 months. But what they did was amazing, she looked better than when she left and was friendly (never handled at last owners place) She rode like a charm for only being there 2 months and left untame. Their methods are a bit odd though. The my sister used, used a Large stuffed animals as person instead of risking his own life to break the horse. Once the horse accepted the stuffed toy the kids actually rode the horse up and down the roads __________________ There is no such thing as an Ignorant horse, there are only Ignorant people!

01-22-2008, 10:05 PM
WarpaintsMom Weanling Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Danville,AL Posts: 250	I am sure there are good Amish trainers out there however I have yet to meet one. A mare I bought last summer had gone to the amish a few months before I purchased her to get her shoes done when she wouldn't stand still they put a metal face mask on her that had spikes on the underside (which ended up damaging her nasial bone and making it difficult for her to breath) and when that didn't work they drove a shoe nail up through her frog which wasn't found til the next day! Where they beat her legs she has permanent damage and understandably won't let very many people near her feet. Such a ruin of a fantastic horse definately wasn't worth the $10 they paid to have her done So I shudder to think of their under saddle training techniques.

01-23-2008, 07:48 AM
beezwing Started Join Date: May 2007 Location: louisiana Posts: 2,380	There are jerks of all religions, creeds, and lifestyles. Affiliation with one form of church does not make one a good or bad horse trainer, the soul and brain you use while training does. When you "use" horses for you work and transportation you would be less sentimental about them. and it is Mennonite..btw k __________________ “Preach the gospel at all times, if necessary use words.” St Francis

01-23-2008, 07:56 AM
99horses Greenbroke Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Pennsylvania Posts: 3,730	We live near a large Amish community and my farrier is a Amish man, my tack comes from the Amish as does alot of my produce that I buy. I have met many that are great with the horses and take the best care of them. We have also met a few I wouldn't trust my worst enemy with. You just have to pick carefully just like with any other trainer. My experinces have been very good with them __________________ I'm your huckleberry.-Doc Holliday Mom to GBM Coltfortyfive aka Marshall

01-23-2008, 07:59 AM
HorseLvr76 Weanling Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 454	I agree with many of the comments that it is based on the individual, and not the religious group stereotype. I have heard and seen many bad things from some Amish, and yet I train for an Amish breeder that has beautiful horses, his barn is immaculate, and he is so quiet and calm with his horses it is amazing! There are bad good and bad trainers, just like there are good and bad people, regardless of race, religion, etc...You just have to research anyone you are interested in having train your horse.

01-23-2008, 08:38 AM
alliebath Long Yearling Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Leavenworth, Kansas Posts: 1,089	We have an Amish "friend" who has done farrier work for us and we also bought a horse from him. We have also pleasure ridden with he and his brother, and even had dinner with he, his wife and two children while we were horse camping close to their home. Charming, delightful people. Would I send my horse to him? No. The horses I have seen them ride have had open sores where equipment has rubbed them, the barn is very deep in manure - and the horse that we bought from him was a problem horse. Not this guys fault, he bought him at a sale and knew nothing about him - when we contacted him about the problems and advice on fixing them - he told my fiance that he would take him back and work on the problem - that he would either fix the problem or break the horse. The method he said he would use to fix him, in my own opinion, was abusive. We did not send the horse, and in fact sold the horse - with FULL disclosure of the problems. Another friend sent a horse to have some miles put on her and was very happy with the training. So much depends on the individual person, horse and issue.

01-23-2008, 08:43 AM
ahlihaff Seasoned Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Western MA Posts: 4,562	As others have stated, there are good and not so good trainers of every kind. One friend had her friendly, happy horse to an Amish trainer. She got him back with a completely different disposition. He was trained all right, but he was a robot - no "soul", no personality. Another one's horse came to her from an Amish trainer as friendly and happy as can be. I do agree with Equine Kneads that the Amish view their horses differently than we do - a means to an end.

01-23-2008, 12:43 PM
pippy Started Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: minnesota Posts: 2,298	Here in MN there are several Amish communities. I've heard good things and bad things about Amish trainers. I know some that send their horses to them to be trained for pulling a buggy, when the horse comes back, it definitely knows what it's doing & respect. I don't know anyone that has sent them to an Amish trainer to be trained for riding purposes. I guess it's not worse then non Amish trainers- some are good, some aren't. __________________ "It's never to late to live happily ever after."