I cant keep her attention!

HeatherSarah3 · 09-13-2007, 03:40 PM

SORRY in advance this is going to be a jumbled up mess of a story im frustrated an d my thoughts are running wild. I appologize in advance for the length and the horrible grammer.

I rode Gypsie for the first time in the arena last night. taking into consideration that she is in a new environment and with a new owner/rider and shes 5. I couldnt keep her attention for squat! I just wanted to walk her around the arena and do some turns and practice on our whoa and backing up. This proved to be way more complicated than everimagined. The minute we got into the arena she went every where almost like she didnt even realize i was on her! She walked all over me

On the trail Iwas able to use real light commands and she was really responsive. I found myself getting really frustrated and using too much force with my hands (im riding her in snaffle) but she wasnt listening so i thought okay ill lunge her. so i did she trotted out and bagan kickin and buckin then settles into a trot and i worked her on both sides by this time it was practically dark but i got back on her walked her out she was doing much better and i even got a nice smooth 3-4 pace back up out of her. So i decided to end it on a good note and i walked her back. tied her to the fence in a half tie, and the snot was trying to reach the ground with her lips the lead rope ended up over her poll and she tried to come up and spooked and set back and busted the fence! Wich is another problem iv been having. She wants to eat EVRYTHING! she will walk over her own face to try to eat somthing. Other horses iv had i just give them a quick bop of reins and they stop or i just get after them verbally. Gypsie though i can swat her neck pull as hard as i can to get her head up and she just goes about eating like im a fly or something! I dont want to pull on her mouth because i dont want her to get hard! Same goes for when Im riding her. Shes lookin around and not paying attention. I try to do my normal flick of the wrist to get her attention and it doesnt work! I was trying to do turns and diffrent patterns to keep her attention but she wasnt having any of it. I didnt want to try trotting or canter because shes not that well gated and just goes into a dead run. If im having this many problems at a walk im not getting into it with her at a trot.
I just hope i can find a good trainer soon for me and her! I got her to square off and lower her head though, she walks out pretty good too. Then I lose her attention.

Thanks guys I just needed to vent.
by the way the advice you all gave on backing under saddle was really helpfull to me thanks!

XO
Heather

montanagirl · 09-13-2007, 05:37 PM

Sorry for your frustration. When I first started working Rooster in an indoor arena he was convinced it was full of horse-eating monsters. It took several sessions for him to relax. Can you bring a chair, sit in the middle of the arena, and let him explore it while you're there? (That only works if no one else is around, obviously, but it worked for us.)

championhorse · 09-13-2007, 05:45 PM

Hi
Buy a crop with a popper on the end of it. When she isn't paying attention or is forcing you to pull a lot harder just pop her shoulder with it.
It gets their attention fast, and it doesn't hurt them at all. I use one for horses I am starting that don't want to walk as well.

Great for getting their attention, when she starts to listen better, you wont need it anymore.

**seerfarm** · 09-13-2007, 05:52 PM

I seriously think that going back to the basics is what she needs. I understand she is young but even at her current age there should be no reason for some of the behavior. You need to establish yourself as boss mare and expect nothing less. Walking over you to eat and yanking and pulling back to break a fence is the beginning of very dangerous behavior ahead. It may seem a little tedious, but in the long run it will make for a happier and much more safe relationship!

championhorse · 09-13-2007, 05:52 PM

Also: If she is pulling on you to eat all the time, keep her halter on underneath her bridle, and tie it to her horn, so she can't put her head down. (this is also good for green horses that buck. If they can't get their head down, they can't get any power behind the buck.) In your case, you wont have to worry about her pulling on you all the time.

Also the pulling back thing....If you turn her lose in a round pen, or enclosure with nothing to eat and leave a halter and rope on her (make sure you can keep an eye on her) This is good for getting them used to giving to preasure. Just let her walk around on her own, eventually she will realize that it does her no good to flip out, and she will calmly move off the rope. Which will help you out next time she is tied and feels some pull. (this is also good for getting babies to learn to lead.)

**gbarmranch** · 09-13-2007, 07:02 PM

I agree with Seerfarm - do some round penning for respect with her, tie her up for a while at different times, use a stud chain when you lead her if you need to..

She ignores you because she does not respect you as her leader..

HeatherSarah3 · 09-14-2007, 01:58 PM

I am taking all of your advice! Championhorse the crop is a really good idea! Why didnt I think of that? lol. Im going to work her on the ground ASAP. I see a struggle for domanence(sp?) between us. I need to be more assurtive and work on her ground manners. Thank you guys SO much for your help!

I will keep posting about our progress. Thanks Again

XO
Heather & Gypsie

HeatherSarah3 · 09-14-2007, 02:15 PM

Champion: When you say to leave a halter and rope on her in small enclosure, It kind of went over my head. What do i do with the rope?

Sorry for my dumbness! lol Im still learning.

**gbarmranch** · 09-14-2007, 02:53 PM

You use an old lead rope attached to a nylon halter - when they step on it, they have to stop - it teaches them to "give" to pressure as the only one they will be fighting is themself..

ruffian · 09-14-2007, 03:03 PM

I just wanted to add my two cents about the pulling thing
What type of bit are you using?
I understand that you don't want to be heavy handed with her, but some work on the bit in reaction to her bad behaviour won't ruin her mouth.
If you are using a bit without shanks, there can and should be some contact at all times, they have to learn to accept that.
When they start trying to snatch the bit out of your hands, sometimes you have to set your hands so that they run into the bit, it hurts but they soon learn.
I agree this is all about manners, back to basics, get her respect when you are on the ground and all will go better in the saddle.

HeatherSarah3 · 09-14-2007, 04:24 PM

Okay I gottcha now.

Im using an O Ring snaffle I do keep my reins tight but she throws her head up when she is really wanting to be defiant. She responds to the CSaw action and tucks her head then i can push her back into the bit. I suppose this will just take repatition. I assume things will be better when I establish a solid foundation on the ground as well.

HeatherSarah3 · 09-14-2007, 04:35 PM

would you suggest just focusing on working her on the ground for a few weeks before I even ride her?

ruffian · 09-14-2007, 04:40 PM

This is hard to explain when writing, but if you are using a snaffle and asking for contact, the reins are not really "tight" it should feel like a couple pounds of weight, or enough that you could hold the reins lightly between your finger and thumb. If it is too tight, she will just lean on you and get dead in the mouth or get frustrated and defiant and toss her head up. It is always give and take. When you want her to soften, drop her head, relax her jaw and give to the rein, you have to ride her forward with seat and leg to the bit, not bring her from the bit back to your leg and seat.
I'm not suggesting that this is what you are doing, I just wanted to clarify what I said.
Turning also comes from leg and seat, not just reins.
She may be bored, you might have to mix things up to keep her attention. Lots of walk /trot and trot/walk transitions, circles, figure eights. Anything to keep her guessing.

ruffian · 09-14-2007, 04:42 PM

OOps missed your most recent post
Yup, ground work is always good, you already figured she doesn't respect you on the ground. Lunge her, (with side reins if you know how or have someone to help you) ground drive her. Teach her to side pass from the ground by responding to pressure or a tap on her side. Then when you ride she'll be more sensitive to your leg and you can start some leg yielding.

**seerfarm** · 09-14-2007, 04:43 PM

I would. You can never do to much ground work. You will find that with a good ground work foundation translating it into the saddle makes it so much easier. They have a better understanding of what is being asked of them, but with much less muss and fuss.

HeatherSarah3 · 09-14-2007, 05:16 PM

Ruffian: thanks I appreciate your help! My solution to the "tight" rein situation is I hold my hands out alittle farther than one normally would. This way i can have light contact when she is behaving and if i need to I can bring my arms back to get control. I hope that made sence? So far shes been responding to my seat an legs. No problems there (yet?)
Your comment on pushing her into the bit. makes perfect sencem, and works really well when shes cooperating. When she tried to run through the bit is when is got hairy.?. In that case should i continue to push her forward and just wait for her give in?

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09-13-2007, 03:40 PM
HeatherSarah3 Weanling Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Fresno, Ca Posts: 292	I cant keep her attention! SORRY in advance this is going to be a jumbled up mess of a story im frustrated an d my thoughts are running wild. I appologize in advance for the length and the horrible grammer. I rode Gypsie for the first time in the arena last night. taking into consideration that she is in a new environment and with a new owner/rider and shes 5. I couldnt keep her attention for squat! I just wanted to walk her around the arena and do some turns and practice on our whoa and backing up. This proved to be way more complicated than everimagined. The minute we got into the arena she went every where almost like she didnt even realize i was on her! She walked all over me On the trail Iwas able to use real light commands and she was really responsive. I found myself getting really frustrated and using too much force with my hands (im riding her in snaffle) but she wasnt listening so i thought okay ill lunge her. so i did she trotted out and bagan kickin and buckin then settles into a trot and i worked her on both sides by this time it was practically dark but i got back on her walked her out she was doing much better and i even got a nice smooth 3-4 pace back up out of her. So i decided to end it on a good note and i walked her back. tied her to the fence in a half tie, and the snot was trying to reach the ground with her lips the lead rope ended up over her poll and she tried to come up and spooked and set back and busted the fence! Wich is another problem iv been having. She wants to eat EVRYTHING! she will walk over her own face to try to eat somthing. Other horses iv had i just give them a quick bop of reins and they stop or i just get after them verbally. Gypsie though i can swat her neck pull as hard as i can to get her head up and she just goes about eating like im a fly or something! I dont want to pull on her mouth because i dont want her to get hard! Same goes for when Im riding her. Shes lookin around and not paying attention. I try to do my normal flick of the wrist to get her attention and it doesnt work! I was trying to do turns and diffrent patterns to keep her attention but she wasnt having any of it. I didnt want to try trotting or canter because shes not that well gated and just goes into a dead run. If im having this many problems at a walk im not getting into it with her at a trot. I just hope i can find a good trainer soon for me and her! I got her to square off and lower her head though, she walks out pretty good too. Then I lose her attention. Thanks guys I just needed to vent. by the way the advice you all gave on backing under saddle was really helpfull to me thanks! XO Heather

09-13-2007, 05:37 PM
montanagirl Yearling Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Montana Posts: 591	Sorry for your frustration. When I first started working Rooster in an indoor arena he was convinced it was full of horse-eating monsters. It took several sessions for him to relax. Can you bring a chair, sit in the middle of the arena, and let him explore it while you're there? (That only works if no one else is around, obviously, but it worked for us.) __________________ No hour is ever wasted that is spent in the saddle. --Winston Churchill

09-13-2007, 05:45 PM
championhorse Long Yearling Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 1,385	Hi Buy a crop with a popper on the end of it. When she isn't paying attention or is forcing you to pull a lot harder just pop her shoulder with it. It gets their attention fast, and it doesn't hurt them at all. I use one for horses I am starting that don't want to walk as well. Great for getting their attention, when she starts to listen better, you wont need it anymore. __________________ Rev 19:11 I saw heaven standing open and there before me was a white horse, whose rider is called Faithful and True. The armies of heaven were following him, riding on white horses and dressed in fine linen, white and clean. 15 Out of his mouth comes a sharp sword with which to strike down the nations.

09-13-2007, 05:52 PM
seerfarm Super Moderator Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Out with the Herd! Posts: 8,233	I seriously think that going back to the basics is what she needs. I understand she is young but even at her current age there should be no reason for some of the behavior. You need to establish yourself as boss mare and expect nothing less. Walking over you to eat and yanking and pulling back to break a fence is the beginning of very dangerous behavior ahead. It may seem a little tedious, but in the long run it will make for a happier and much more safe relationship! __________________ "Year's end is neither an end nor a beginning but a going on, with all the wisdom that experience can instill in us". ~Hal Borland

09-13-2007, 07:02 PM
gbarmranch Administrator Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Mayberry Posts: 29,570	I agree with Seerfarm - do some round penning for respect with her, tie her up for a while at different times, use a stud chain when you lead her if you need to.. She ignores you because she does not respect you as her leader.. __________________ Quality Foundation Quarter Horses http://home.earthlink.net/~vpgann As you slide down the banister of life, may the splinters never point in the wrong direction.

09-14-2007, 01:58 PM
HeatherSarah3 Weanling Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Fresno, Ca Posts: 292	I am taking all of your advice! Championhorse the crop is a really good idea! Why didnt I think of that? lol. Im going to work her on the ground ASAP. I see a struggle for domanence(sp?) between us. I need to be more assurtive and work on her ground manners. Thank you guys SO much for your help! I will keep posting about our progress. Thanks Again XO Heather & Gypsie

09-14-2007, 02:15 PM
HeatherSarah3 Weanling Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Fresno, Ca Posts: 292	Champion: When you say to leave a halter and rope on her in small enclosure, It kind of went over my head. What do i do with the rope? Sorry for my dumbness! lol Im still learning.

09-14-2007, 02:53 PM
gbarmranch Administrator Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Mayberry Posts: 29,570	You use an old lead rope attached to a nylon halter - when they step on it, they have to stop - it teaches them to "give" to pressure as the only one they will be fighting is themself.. __________________ Quality Foundation Quarter Horses http://home.earthlink.net/~vpgann As you slide down the banister of life, may the splinters never point in the wrong direction.

09-14-2007, 03:03 PM
ruffian Long Yearling Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Alberta Posts: 1,015	I just wanted to add my two cents about the pulling thing What type of bit are you using? I understand that you don't want to be heavy handed with her, but some work on the bit in reaction to her bad behaviour won't ruin her mouth. If you are using a bit without shanks, there can and should be some contact at all times, they have to learn to accept that. When they start trying to snatch the bit out of your hands, sometimes you have to set your hands so that they run into the bit, it hurts but they soon learn. I agree this is all about manners, back to basics, get her respect when you are on the ground and all will go better in the saddle. __________________ There is something about the outside of a Horse that\'s good for the inside of a man (Will Rogers)

09-14-2007, 04:24 PM
HeatherSarah3 Weanling Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Fresno, Ca Posts: 292	Okay I gottcha now. Im using an O Ring snaffle I do keep my reins tight but she throws her head up when she is really wanting to be defiant. She responds to the CSaw action and tucks her head then i can push her back into the bit. I suppose this will just take repatition. I assume things will be better when I establish a solid foundation on the ground as well.

09-14-2007, 04:35 PM
HeatherSarah3 Weanling Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Fresno, Ca Posts: 292	would you suggest just focusing on working her on the ground for a few weeks before I even ride her?

09-14-2007, 04:40 PM
ruffian Long Yearling Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Alberta Posts: 1,015	This is hard to explain when writing, but if you are using a snaffle and asking for contact, the reins are not really "tight" it should feel like a couple pounds of weight, or enough that you could hold the reins lightly between your finger and thumb. If it is too tight, she will just lean on you and get dead in the mouth or get frustrated and defiant and toss her head up. It is always give and take. When you want her to soften, drop her head, relax her jaw and give to the rein, you have to ride her forward with seat and leg to the bit, not bring her from the bit back to your leg and seat. I'm not suggesting that this is what you are doing, I just wanted to clarify what I said. Turning also comes from leg and seat, not just reins. She may be bored, you might have to mix things up to keep her attention. Lots of walk /trot and trot/walk transitions, circles, figure eights. Anything to keep her guessing. __________________ There is something about the outside of a Horse that\'s good for the inside of a man (Will Rogers)

09-14-2007, 04:42 PM
ruffian Long Yearling Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Alberta Posts: 1,015	OOps missed your most recent post Yup, ground work is always good, you already figured she doesn't respect you on the ground. Lunge her, (with side reins if you know how or have someone to help you) ground drive her. Teach her to side pass from the ground by responding to pressure or a tap on her side. Then when you ride she'll be more sensitive to your leg and you can start some leg yielding. __________________ There is something about the outside of a Horse that\'s good for the inside of a man (Will Rogers)

09-14-2007, 04:43 PM
seerfarm Super Moderator Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Out with the Herd! Posts: 8,233	I would. You can never do to much ground work. You will find that with a good ground work foundation translating it into the saddle makes it so much easier. They have a better understanding of what is being asked of them, but with much less muss and fuss. __________________ "Year's end is neither an end nor a beginning but a going on, with all the wisdom that experience can instill in us". ~Hal Borland

09-14-2007, 05:16 PM
HeatherSarah3 Weanling Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Fresno, Ca Posts: 292	Ruffian: thanks I appreciate your help! My solution to the "tight" rein situation is I hold my hands out alittle farther than one normally would. This way i can have light contact when she is behaving and if i need to I can bring my arms back to get control. I hope that made sence? So far shes been responding to my seat an legs. No problems there (yet?) Your comment on pushing her into the bit. makes perfect sencem, and works really well when shes cooperating. When she tried to run through the bit is when is got hairy.?. In that case should i continue to push her forward and just wait for her give in?