How Do You Teach Your Horse To Sidepass?

[Sonseeahray's_girl]

I am trying to teach this to my horse, but since I have never done that before, I'm probably going about it all wrong, so I need help!

He is very good with leg cues, and will yield his hindquarters very nicely. The problem is that I get the back end yielding fine, but the front end won't follow suit. I know I'm doing something wrong, but what? He ends up getting frustrated with me, like "WHAT DO YOU WANT ALREADY!!!" If someone would be so kind as to spell the process out, then maybe I could get it!

[gbarmranch]

Well, you are half way there...

When you ask for a side pass, you need o make sure he understands shoulders in first...I always do this on a fence line - they only have one way they can go... then do tbe same thing in an open arena area... he should get the idea...make sure you shorten the inside rein, lots of leg, and loosen the outside rein... He will not do it well at first, so reward any little attempt, and only do a few at a time - then go on to something else and come back to it. Does this help, or did I confuse you more.

[EquineAlberta]

It sounds to me like you already know the answer...he listens well to leg aids...but it is more the rein aids that control the horses shoulders in the side pass.

I agree that you may find it easiest to do the sidepass while facing a wall or fence. To do the side pass, you use your left seat bone to push the horse to the right, together with left leg behind the girth, and apply a slight bit of pressure to the left side of the neck with your left rein. This will tell the horse to move his hind legs sideways to the right, followed by the horse’s front legs. The right rein opens up slightly to allow the horse to move over to the right (think of it as openning a door to allow the horse to move over).

If your horse isn't moving its forehand along with the hindquarters, it is usually due to the horse not understanding the rein aids (or the rein aids not being applied properly). Excercises such as turn on the haunches, shoulder-in and leg yield will help you practice the same type of aids.

Hope this helped!

Karen2

[Sonseeahray's_girl]

Thanks for the advice! I'll try the suggestions tomorrow and post what happens.

He can do a pivot on his haunches from the ground, and go all the way around with hardly any movement of his hind feet. I just need to translate that into the same movement while in the saddle. Yesterday I was giving a strong left leg, pressed my left arm (and rein) in, and gave a wide open door with the right, but he still didn't get it. He tends to back up, and then start moving around until we are completely out of position and he's totally confused!

I'll try again, and see what happens!

[doyle82]

Also, remember that horses have a side that they are more comfortable going. Most horses are more comfortable on one lead over the other.
The same rings true in the sidepass. I also read somewhere recently (Think it was Horse & Rider) that its easier for most horses to sidepass to the left. I don't know why bit thats what it said. (Of course I'm in the process of teaching sidepassing to my boy as well and he prefers to go right but hey )

[mellowdane]

Personally I always teach the sidepass from the ground before I do it from the saddle.

I put the horse facing a wall or arena fence. I use my dressage whip or my stick to cue with taps. I start by yielding the forequarters a step or two..then the hindquarters.. alternate them so you are sort of see-sawing. Every step, stop, praise, relax. The biggest thing is to get it to one or two CALM steps. If they are running away from you with every step then they wont be ready for you to cue the other end of the body.

Then I start staying closer to the midsection of the horse (not going towards the front for the forequarters or the back for the hind) and I use my dressage whip or carrot stick or whatever you are using and hold it vertically (handle slightly over my head, end hanging down so I can tap lightly..more of a free swinging tap). I tap right at the girth line. If the horse is very new.. I'll tap a little back..and then a little forward.. then right on the girth. Basically you are making the cue as subtle as possible and still being as unambiguous as you can.

When they are sidepassing smoothly I replace my tapping cue with a pressure cue from the flat hand of my hand (at this point using a riding crop can be easier to handle in case you need to go back to a familiar cue).. then from my finger.. then I will tack them up and use the pressure cue from the side of the stirrup.

When they are moving sideways smoothly, move away from your wall or fence. You may have to give a small tap on the leadrope to keep them from walking forward at first. You may even have to go back a couple steps and do a little see-sawing before you have your good sidepass out in the open.

Within 3 days I had my 3yo (who hasnt been backed yet) sidepassing beautifully with light pressure and a clucking sound. In the barn I did find that she sidepasses VERY well going towards her stall..and a little heavier away from her stall so I just turn her in both directions and go towards her stall so she gets practice on both sides. In the arena it doesnt matter though..haha.

It has become a game at night (well fun for me.. not so much for her).. she comes out and gets groomed before dinner..then in order to get back to her stall for her grain she has to sidepass, back, pivot, square up.. all sorts of things to get in to her stall. She backs like nobodies business through narrow doorways!! Sometimes I set up a row of buckets in the aisle way and she has to back, then sidepass through them.. then back.. then sidepass through them.. then do a pivot on the forehand around the end.. then sidepass to her door.. then I open it.. pivot around so her butt is pointed at the door..then back in the door. Great little schooling session we have every night.. with a reward at the end for her!

I hope I wasnt clear as mud haha.. good luck

[Sonseeahray's_girl]

Mellowdane, that sounds suspiciously like the Parelli level 1 stuff Which I HAVE tried over and over, but he just doesn't get that particular game.

I can make him sidepass from the ground by using pressure on his neck and hip, and can get him to yield his forehand and hindquarters easily also. Just this sideways stuff in the saddle isn't working.

I didn't ride yesterday and it looks like I won't be today either since it is pouring rain out. But I will try again and keep you all posted!

[mellowdane]

I havent really looked at parelli stuff.. I'm a CA fan myself.. and this is how I taught my first horse when I was 14 too.

But anyway.. well if you are only doing sidepassing with pressure on the hip and shoulder from the ground you are skipping a step. You have to also get them moving just from pressure at your leg area. You dont have two legs on each side in the saddle, eh! If you want them to move away from pressure from your leg at the girth (or slightly behind) then that is what you have to simulate on the ground. If you have to use pressure on both front and back on the ground..that is what you can expect to have to do in the saddle.. it is just a lot more complicated to do when you are riding.

[Sonseeahray's_girl]

You're right! Of course it isn't working in the saddle, since I am not a four legged human!

Okay, so then how do I get him to go sideways on the ground using pressure at the girth area? He tends to yield his hindquarters a lot when I have put a little pressure on there before ( like in the barn, when I'm trying to reposition him for grooming, etc). Any suggestions?

I know he will get it once I figure out how the heck to ask! He is a quick learner and almost sighs with relief when he finally understands what the heck I want.

[mellowdane]

Hm.. well there are a lot of ways you can do that transition from shoulder and hip to the girth. I usually just keep getting closer and closer with my movements until they are pretty much in the same area.. but... if you are getting frustrated..or your horse is just not gettin it.. here is what I would recommend.

Get your stick or dressage whip.. or lunge whip(with the lash wound up).. something in the 4ft range. Hold it in the middle with your fist (2ft on each side.. or even one end slightly longer since the hip is a little further away than the shoulder).

Hold it parallel to the ground.

Stand next to your horse, lets say the left side, with your stick in your right hand, lead in left. Put your knuckles right behind your girth area (like your heel would be). Now your stick can tap the shoulder and the hip with just a shift of your wrist if you need a little encouragement.

Use a little pressure with your knuckles and a cluck and ask for a little movement. If you dont get at least a shifting of pressure away from your hand tap with your whip on the shoulder first until you get at least a shifting of weight. The front end is usually the harder end, so unless the hip is dragging behind I dont cue that quite as often. This way you are use your whip as a backup cue to help make that transition a little clearer.

Usually I dont have to do this.. but for horses that just arent getting it, it can make things a lot easier. Also if you are actually riding.. until your horse is moving away from leg pressure at a walk, trot and canter, you arent going to get a sidepass. It is hardest to get that movement away from pressure at a standstill. Start by walking on the rail.. use your outside leg and push off the rail a couple feet, then use the inside leg to push back towards the rail. It is harder than it seems and you dont want to be pushing HARD (your leg goes numb about the time their ribcage does) or kicking to get movement (this is yielding to PRESSURE not yielding to a kick).. that just makes the horse deader and less responsive. Tapping a crop right behind your heel or using a wee bit of spur to "goose" (not jab or impale..hahaha) will usually keep them lighter and keep your cues clear but subtle.

The leg yield really is the basis of the lead change so it is something ya gotta get down. Good luck and I hope I have made this reasonably clear..haha

Clearer than mud,
Melisa

[Sonseeahray's_girl]

Okay I'll try!

Last night when I went out to feed, I tried just getting him to do a sidepass from pressure at the girth, from the ground. He did it! Didn't like it mind you and gave me the most annoyed look about it ("look lady, I'm here to get fed, not play your silly little games"), but I got one step sideways and the licking and chewing afterwards.

But I didn't spend much time on it, so I'll have to have another go at it next time I'm with him.

I think I'm going to train him to do it when I apply the pressure at the girth, since to him, if I put my heel behind the girth, it translates into just the hind end disengaging. Maybe I trained him wrong, but that's what he does, and I get lovely tight turns from that.

[Sonseeahray's_girl]

Update! I tried the stick parallel to the ground thing, and it worked great! I can now get at least one good sideways movement from both sides! Great suggestions.

I will keep working at it until it's really sharp from the ground and then work on it in saddle, applying the other suggestions posted from all of you guys.

Thanks again!