The Bits and Bitting Thread

[greygirls]

Thanks, I don't think it's meant to be used with a curb though...I'm not sure. If it is, I'll need info on that too as I've never used one.

[cutter123]

edited because almost mozart added the information to her post

Thanks for this thread, you are doing great!!
(when you get to spade bits I can help again if you want )

[EquineAlberta]

Greygirls, sometimes those bits are not used with a curb strap, but they can be. Without the curb strap the bit is pulled up into the horses teeth, and the mouthpiece will drag their tongue way far back into their throat.

The curb strap will limit this, but will put the mouth peice pressure more down on the bars and less back onto the teeth.

In English is is called a "3-ring", Dutch gag, or Pesoa bit.

Many english people will use them with two reins, a snaffle and a curb rein.

I would only use this bit with the two reins. One thing you need to be careful about with this bit when used with english short reins, is how much back you have to pull to really use that lower ring...it will throw you into pull mode as your arms will have to come back quite a bit to really use it and you will loose a relaxed hand.

"Draw bits" shown (usually just called Gags in english), are also meant to be used with a rein on the snaffle, and one on the gag ring. These bits also pull the bit into the teeth, and can actually fracture the teeth when used with enough force (such as by eventers/jumpers/barrel racers).

Karen

[DanielleS]

I find that the Elevator bit, pictured above by Greygirls is a great bit. My horses love it, I do have soft hands so I guess that is a requirement. I do not find it to be harsh at all, in fact it keeps you from having to be rough on the mouth. I would not recommend to use it with a curb chain or double reins. But all the people I know who use them have very good hands and are very experienced riders, I would not recommend this bit to someone who is not an experienced rider or doesn't know how to regulate pressure on the horses mouth. I also recommend to use a happy mouth elevator.

[pasopony]

Also, just want to add that any type of curb bit (that is a bit with shanks and a curb strap), will not only put pressure on the mouth/bars/tongue/palate/lips (depending on the mouthpiece), but will also put pressure under the horse's jaw AND tighten down on the bridle and exert pressure on the sensitive area of the poll at the nerves. The longer the shanks, the more severe the pressure on all three areas. Gag/elevator/draw bits intensify the pressure on the poll.

[almost_mozart]

Cutter, I'll add your bosal information (I was needing that). Go ahead and write about spade bits too, pretty please.

[almost_mozart]

I also wanted to add that the two pairs of reins (snaffle and curb) is an English thing (man, it's been a long time since I did any of that). Any Western people would look at you like you were crazy if they saw you with that set-up. Ill-education on their part? Perhaps. But Western draw bits are not even made with a place for a second pair of reins--there usually isn't any place to put them on the "snaffle" part.

There's also a bit philosophy difference between English and Western folks, from what I've seen. English people seem to be of the opinion that one should always use the gentlest bit the horse will respond to and think that a lot of Western equipment is barbaric. As a whole, we Westerners are more of the opinion that as long as a rider has soft hands, he can get by with using a bigger bit. Look at these pictures of bits--some of those are downright monstrosities, but with the right hands/rider/experience/horse, the animal will respond just fine, still love his job, learn a lot, and not suffer any pain or mouth damage. "In the right hands," of course, being the operative phrase.

[almost_mozart]

Now for some specific examples of different types of bits.

Tom Thumbs and Argentine Snaffles

The Tom Thumb is a bit that gets a bad rap for being very harsh--I've heard stories of people breaking their horse's jaw with it. Now, that seems a little exaggerated to me (I can't imagine how much pressure they'd have to be exerting on the reins to cause that much damage), and while I don't consider the TT to be particularly cruel, I just plain don't like it for a variety of reasons. Many people do use and love this bit, swearing by it and using it for training colts. To each his own, but my personal opinion is that there are better bits on the market.



This, right here, is a true Tom Thumb--and the worst one around. The straight shanks don't give the horse any warning at all--the second you apply pressure, they pop right around, snatching the curb and activating the nutcracker effect with the mouthpiece. It also makes direct reining difficult--the straight shanks, combined with the way the mouthpiece attaches to the shanks (no freedom whatsoever), mean that when you pull on one side, the entire bit twists rather painfully in the horses mouth. The curved shank versions aren't quite as bad, but it's still quite difficult for the rider to convey the intended cue to the horse, no matter how light or heavy his hands are. This bit just doesn't have a whole lot of finesse in the horse's mouth--it's all or nothing.

Now compare the above bit this, your standard Argentine Snaffle.



At first glance, they look very similar. But the Argentine is much better balanced. Look at the curved shanks--these make it less harsh, and a slight touch of the rein will give a horse warning that a cue is coming. Also, the joint between the two parts of the mouthpiece is finished better, so it will be less likely to pinch. Most importantly, the attachment from mouthpiece-shank is not fixed in the vertical direction. This gives both parts some freedom and independent movement. I can't really explain exactly why this is better, it just is. Ask any horse--most will respond so much better to bits of this type.

Of course, the snaffle mouthpiece in both bits has the potential to "nutcracker," so be careful with that. A three-piece mouth is more desireable in most cases.

[almost_mozart]

Little "S" Hackamore
(my personal favorite)



I love to use the Little S on greenies who hate bits, horses who need to lighten up in the mouth, those who need noseband action but not a full-fledged combination bit, horses who are learning to neck-rein but are confused by shanked bits, those who know the basics of lateral movement but still need some work on it; in the training pen, while trail riding, and on some barrel horses. Needless to say, it's extremely versatile.

Pulling on the reins rotates the "S" shank that gives the hackamore its name. This tightens the curb chain and brings the noseband down slightly. I consider this to be a rather mild hackamore with an almost bit-like action.

It's good for both direct reining and neck reining (I actually try to teach neck reining in a snaffle bit, but the bit's action makes this rather difficult. As you put your rein across a colt's neck, the bit pulls on their mouth slighlty, confusing them and giving them a conflicting signal. So I switch to a hackamore or halter to test how much they know, and suddenly they get a lot more comfortable neck reining because there aren't two commands going on at once). And, for a hackamore, it has a suprisingly good amound of lift, bend, and flex.

It's not the best for collection. I recommend teaching collection in another bit, then switching to the hack. The knowledge should transfer over.

The short, curvy shanks make this a very gentle hackamore when compared to several others. If your horse is dead-broke, extremely light-mouthed, or if you're in a very nice mood, the curb chain can be replaced with a leather curb strap and the rope noseband with a leather one. This makes the hackamore very, very soft. I think this is unneccessary if you have light hands, though.

[almost_mozart]

I could still use some help writing about spade bits, bitless bridles, English bits, or anything else I forgot.

I'm going to keep adding specific examples for as long as my attention span lasts.

Can/should this be sticky-fied?

[DutchessMare]

This is a very good thread. Its very interesting finding out what certain bits do. All these excess bits in my tack shed all have names now lol.

[cutter123]

Spade Bits....

Almost Mozart, I dont' know how detailed you want me to get. I could write an entire thesis on hackamores, two reins, half breeds, and spade bits, and the process of putting a horse "straight up in a bridle."

I'll write this and then you can take what you want and include it in your thread

Spade Bits.

A spade bit looks very severe, and is not for beginner hands, or beginner horses. A spade bit can be a work of art, like this custom made one:



What makes a true spade is the mouthpiece. Notice the straight bar, the high cathedral port, the copper spoon and braces, and the roller, called a cricket. A curb bit that does not have all these elements is not a true spade, and is commonly called a "half breed." This mouthpiece makes the Spade bit a bit that a horse learns to pick up and carry in his mouth. Although a Spade bit has a curb strap and therefore leverage, it is not a leverage bit like other curbs. It is a "signal" bit; it is designed to give the horse signals with very subtle hand movements.

True Bridle horses go through extensive training, starting in a rawhide bosal hackamore, into a two rein (which is a small bosal worn under a bridle used in conjunction with the bridle and two sets of reins, mecate reins on the bosal, and romal reins on the bridle), and finally into a full bridle (Spade). A horse is thoroughly trained in all the complicated maneuvers he must perform before he ever gets into a spade bit. The spade bit's purpose is to send the horse very subtle rein signals; the signals from the reins travel to the shank. The movements of the shank equally move the long tapered port. The good bridle horses are said to be "velvet mouthed," and respond smoothly to almost inperceptable rein signals. A Spade bit is designed to be used with Romal style reins.

This tradition of bits and bitting came from the Californios, descendents of the Spanish conquistadores who settled old California. These men were ranchers and stockmen, and needed highly trained stock horses able to be easily maneuvered with one hand, as the rider needed his other hand to rope. The Spanish riding tradition has it's roots in Classical Dressage; the maneuvers one needs to do to have an effective war charger or effectively work cattle are similar.

Notice a spade bit has a straight bar instead of a raised port like other leverage bits. This design sits the bit evenly across the tongue. When a signal is given, the horse feels it first on his tongue, which is a fatty type muscle, instead of the bars of his mouth. Therefore even though it looks severe, with preparation, this type of configuration is actually less severe. With a straight bar, a horse can brace his tongue. That is why half breed and grazing style curb bits were designed with a port that allows for "tongue relief." What this means is the pressure is distributed to the ends of the mouthpiece onto the horse's bars. Because there is a raised space in the middle of that style mouthpiece for the horse's tongue, it makes it more difficult for the horse to brace his tongue against the bit. In a Spade with a straight mouthpiece, there is no "tongue relief" but the horse's sensitive bars are spared. By the time a horse is "straight up in the bridle," any tendency to brace his tongue against the bit has already been trained out of him. If a horse is bracy in a spade bit, then he is not broke enough to carry it and should be taken back down to a more intermediate stage to work on foundation issues.

The cheek pieces of a true spade and most half breed bits are completely straight. This is designed to keep the horse's head exactly on the vertical. On a half breed or leverage style curb bit, the more the shanks are swept back, the more above the vertical (poked out) the horse carries his nose. You can test this by resting the bit's mouthpiece in your outstretched palm to see how it sits. This is called the bit's "balance." The cheek pieces are designed to compliment the mouthpiece to give a bit it's certain balance. This is designed to teach the horse how to carry himself in a balanced manner. When a horse is travelling balanced, no matter the speed, the spade will feel good and comfortable in his mouth and he will carry it properly. The fancy designs thus serve a purpose. The different styles of cheek pieces can include moons, stars, hearts, or other fancy silver engraved designs. The design pictured is called the Santa Barbara style design. Most traditional designs were named after the region they were favored or where the bitmaker was from.

The Bridle Horse is a horse that goes on a loose rein. With a Spade Bit, the reins are seldom, if ever, pulled tight. The horse can feel the slightest slack being taken out of the reins. Most romal reins are attached to the spade bit with weighted chains, which increase the "feel." If a rider has to pull on the reins, the horse is not ready to be in a spade. If a rider is not comfortable with loose rein riding, a spade bit is not a good choice.

Most riders will never have an occasion to use a Spade bit. The use of a spade bit requres a great deal of responsibility from a rider. There are some horsemen who do things according to the Traditional Californio methods of horsemanship. Most Cow Horse riders today who compete in National Reined Cow Horse Association events ride and show their older Bridle Horses in half breed style bits. A half breed has cheek pieces like a spade but lacks some of the elements in the mouthpiece, like the long tapered spoon and copper braces. A half breed cowhorse bit does have a cricket (roller).

[EquineAlberta]

Mozart, I think the difference between English and Western is an important thing to note. English riders want to take a feel of the mouth, whereas most western riders what to have as little mouth contact as possible. Sadly I don't think that means english riders want the most gentle bit, but they should. Anyone should.

I think most people don't realize the pain a bit causes in the mouth, and don't realize how kind horses are to tolerate it.

Karen

[DanielleS]

Personally, as a strictly english rider/trainer, I want a bit that makes my horse happy and comfy. I have good soft hands and a good seat, and expect my horse to respond to my seat and legs before my hands, a strong bit is only used when absolutely necessary, and even a strong bit can be used gently to help the horse learn to move properly. MVP loves the elevator happy mouth I got for him, so I am using it. Frostie hated it, so I will not ride him in it. He was very happy with his copper wrapped bit. It is not like any others pictured here, and I have never been able to find one like it, but he likes it and my previous mare Devon got along well with it as well. I think in English (at least in my experience) we try to be gentle as to keep the horse from getting a hard mouth, and the goal is to have soft hands and a horse that responds to your seat and leg cues.

[cutter123]

Originally Posted by DanielleS

. I think in English (at least in my experience) we try to be gentle as to keep the horse from getting a hard mouth, and the goal is to have soft hands and a horse that responds to your seat and leg cues.

That is not strictly an Enlgish riding goal. That is the goal of proper horsemanship, regardless of discipline or style of tack and saddle.

[DanielleS]

Originally Posted by cutter123

That is not strictly an Enlgish riding goal. That is the goal of proper horsemanship, regardless of discipline or style of tack and saddle.

I agree...but it was mentioned that english riders don't want the most gentle bit possible on a horse, and I disagree. I was just giving my point of view. I didn't mean to imply that western riders weren't aiming for the same thing.

[almost_mozart]

I think you might have misread what I said, DanielleS. I said that (stereotypically, of course) English riders DO want to use the gentlest bit possible. This is coming from by biased Western perspective.

[luckyhorseshoes]

Originally Posted by cutter123

Spade Bits....

Almost Mozart, I dont' know how detailed you want me to get. I could write an entire thesis on hackamores, two reins, half breeds, and spade bits, and the process of putting a horse "straight up in a bridle."

I'll write this and then you can take what you want and include it in your thread

Spade Bits.

A spade bit looks very severe, and is not for beginner hands, or beginner horses. A spade bit can be a work of art, like this custom made one:



What makes a true spade is the mouthpiece. Notice the straight bar, the high cathedral port, the copper spoon and braces, and the roller, called a cricket. A curb bit that does not have all these elements is not a true spade, and is commonly called a "half breed." This mouthpiece makes the Spade bit a bit that a horse learns to pick up and carry in his mouth. Although a Spade bit has a curb strap and therefore leverage, it is not a leverage bit like other curbs. It is a "signal" bit; it is designed to give the horse signals with very subtle hand movements.

True Bridle horses go through extensive training, starting in a rawhide bosal hackamore, into a two rein (which is a small bosal worn under a bridle used in conjunction with the bridle and two sets of reins, mecate reins on the bosal, and romal reins on the bridle), and finally into a full bridle (Spade). A horse is thoroughly trained in all the complicated maneuvers he must perform before he ever gets into a spade bit. The spade bit's purpose is to send the horse very subtle rein signals; the signals from the reins travel to the shank. The movements of the shank equally move the long tapered port. The good bridle horses are said to be "velvet mouthed," and respond smoothly to almost inperceptable rein signals. A Spade bit is designed to be used with Romal style reins.

This tradition of bits and bitting came from the Californios, descendents of the Spanish conquistadores who settled old California. These men were ranchers and stockmen, and needed highly trained stock horses able to be easily maneuvered with one hand, as the rider needed his other hand to rope. The Spanish riding tradition has it's roots in Classical Dressage; the maneuvers one needs to do to have an effective war charger or effectively work cattle are similar.

Notice a spade bit has a straight bar instead of a raised port like other leverage bits. This design sits the bit evenly across the tongue. When a signal is given, the horse feels it first on his tongue, which is a fatty type muscle, instead of the bars of his mouth. Therefore even though it looks severe, with preparation, this type of configuration is actually less severe. With a straight bar, a horse can brace his tongue. That is why half breed and grazing style curb bits were designed with a port that allows for "tongue relief." What this means is the pressure is distributed to the ends of the mouthpiece onto the horse's bars. Because there is a raised space in the middle of that style mouthpiece for the horse's tongue, it makes it more difficult for the horse to brace his tongue against the bit. In a Spade with a straight mouthpiece, there is no "tongue relief" but the horse's sensitive bars are spared. By the time a horse is "straight up in the bridle," any tendency to brace his tongue against the bit has already been trained out of him. If a horse is bracy in a spade bit, then he is not broke enough to carry it and should be taken back down to a more intermediate stage to work on foundation issues.

The cheek pieces of a true spade and most half breed bits are completely straight. This is designed to keep the horse's head exactly on the vertical. On a half breed or leverage style curb bit, the more the shanks are swept back, the more above the vertical (poked out) the horse carries his nose. You can test this by resting the bit's mouthpiece in your outstretched palm to see how it sits. This is called the bit's "balance." The cheek pieces are designed to compliment the mouthpiece to give a bit it's certain balance. This is designed to teach the horse how to carry himself in a balanced manner. When a horse is travelling balanced, no matter the speed, the spade will feel good and comfortable in his mouth and he will carry it properly. The fancy designs thus serve a purpose. The different styles of cheek pieces can include moons, stars, hearts, or other fancy silver engraved designs. The design pictured is called the Santa Barbara style design. Most traditional designs were named after the region they were favored or where the bitmaker was from.

The Bridle Horse is a horse that goes on a loose rein. With a Spade Bit, the reins are seldom, if ever, pulled tight. The horse can feel the slightest slack being taken out of the reins. Most romal reins are attached to the spade bit with weighted chains, which increase the "feel." If a rider has to pull on the reins, the horse is not ready to be in a spade. If a rider is not comfortable with loose rein riding, a spade bit is not a good choice.

Most riders will never have an occasion to use a Spade bit. The use of a spade bit requres a great deal of responsibility from a rider. There are some horsemen who do things according to the Traditional Californio methods of horsemanship. Most Cow Horse riders today who compete in National Reined Cow Horse Association events ride and show their older Bridle Horses in half breed style bits. A half breed has cheek pieces like a spade but lacks some of the elements in the mouthpiece, like the long tapered spoon and copper braces. A half breed cowhorse bit does have a cricket (roller).

WOW I do NOT like the look of THAT bit! way way way to mean. lol

[almost_mozart]

The Perfect Bit



"The Perfect Bit" is a misleading name. "The Kinda Cool Bit" might have been more appropriate. The design of this bit (which comes in a snaffle, short shank, and long shank version, with the option of snaffle mouth, twisted snaffle mouth, or lifesaver) is unique, and at first glance looks like the miracle fix. Rather than relying on fixed, gag, or draw action, the mouthpiece is connected via a ball-and-socket style joint. This allows the cheek piece to rotate 360 degrees and gives the shanks lots of freedom.

Unfortunately, this bit works better in theory than in practice. Don't get me wrong--the Perfect Bit is really neat. However, the rotating shanks don't engage the mouth fully, and every horse I've ever ridden the bit on ends up getting frustrated, then mad, and finally tries to run through the bit with its head stuck up in the air. Once the curb (on the shanked versions) is tightened, the mouthpiece just keeps pulling into the bars, which looks rather uncomfortable. I think this is because the Perfect Bit's patented joint makes it a little too gentle until it engages fully, then it practically chokes the horse.

I think it probably works best training green horses or riding soft-mouthed horses.

Here is the website so you can read for yourself.

http://www.theperfectbit.com/

[almost_mozart]

Originally Posted by luckyhorseshoes

WOW I do NOT like the look of THAT bit! way way way to mean. lol

Are you being serious?