Donkey problems, need help please!!!

[SaddleTrail]

Jasper is my donkey that I got for free or should say for 100 bucks <delivery fee they said>

Ive spent every day with him trying to get him to accept me. Had the farrier out, it was horrible but it got done. The farrier had to use the ropes on him, that was the ONLY way it was going to get done.

I put him in the only pen I have which is my minis pen and ever since then I can not even catch him. Ive had to leave his halter on other wise it would be impossible to even get close.

For the last two days Ive had to rope him. First time was around the neck, he freaked out and fought me hard. I gave him treats after he had calmed down and took two steps to me on the lead I finally got on him. I had to pull with steady pressure.

Yesterday I had to rope him again but this time I got him by the front right foot. OMG he was like a wild and crazy animal, rearing, bucking, kicking out and flying through the air to land on his side 3 or 4 times. I refused to let go and found out exactly how strong I am! I held on to him and put him to the ground. After a few minutes he got up and just panted. So again, I used steady pressure, releasing when he took the slightest step forward. I also gave him treats for every step.
Amazingly, after I had the lead on him and tugged the rope upwards a little bit, he held his foot up for me to take the rope off!!

Then I took the lead off and sat down on my box again just talking to him. While he was just standing there I petted my goat that I keep in with him. When I got up I slowly walked to him, he didnt move, so I touched him, he didnt move, so next thing I know I have my arms around his neck cooing to him, telling him how much I loved him and to please accept me because I didnt want to let him go.

Today at feed time?? He came straight up to the gate, lifted his mouth and let me give him kisses right on his nose.
Yes this is a good sign, but I dont want to rope him every time. I am 53, use canes to walk and my hubby gave me one more month to get him to the point that I can do something with him.

Please, I need all the help and tips I can get. The farrier says I have to have him tamed down enough for him to trim him again in a month.

He reacts so strongly to any touches from his chest down. Impossible on his legs, his back just maybe a little.

If I could get him to let me lead him around the yard with a lead, let the farrier do his feet with no fear and will let me and hubby pet him I will be able to keep him, other wise hubby says he has to go.

Thank you for reading all of this but I am desperate to keep him with me.

[Rafflesgirl]

I'm not an expert on donkey's nor am I a trainer, but it sounds to me like you need to start from the very beginning with him, to get him to trust you. Spending lots of time with him, talking to him, touching him and grooming him, etc, etc. Give him lots of treats and most of all it will take time for him to accept you and accept all the things that need done, such as the farrier. It really may take more time than a month. Just go slowly with him and eventually you will win him over. Just curious, why is your husband giving you just a month? It may take longer to turn him into the nice guy he can end up being.

[SaddleTrail]

Hi and thank you for replying.

I got him in Aug, and I have been doing all of that. He wont allow me to touch him. If I rope him, put a lead on him, he will stand there and a few times let me brush my hand over his back and ears. Other then that you cant do anything with him.

The girl I got him from said he was a mini donk, he is not, he is a small standard. Said he was completely tamed and you could do anything with him, not even close. I honestly don't even think he is halter broke. I shouldnt have taken him but I just couldnt help my self, he needed love and I thought he needed me.

[HighValleyRanch]

I read your story and saw your last posts. Asked before if he was penned in with the others..
That he came up to you after the battle is a good sign. A sign of submission.
Sometimes after a battle like that they will soften. He came up to you on his own. He is telling you something.

I have four donkeys. I went through three farriers who could not work on them. One girl would only do the fronts. Finally when adam got his bad abscess, the vet found me a great farrier. Old cowboy type, that was both firm and yet soft. He knew animals! When to be firm, and when to be soft. Had to sedate the mammoth jack the first time and cross tie him and still a huge battle with three of us holding him. by the third time, he had that jack settled down to where he could trim on a loose lead. So when one time, the jack kicked at him, Johnny put a rope around his neck and body and tied up his rear. That was all it took after a few fights against the rope. Adam knew he had met his match!LOL But, (this is the important part), the farrier could see this, and took Adams rear foot out of the hobble and worked on him softly. The jack knew that Johnny could put his foot back in at any time, so he GAVE UP!

I am telling you this story for a reason. It showed me the intelligence of the animals. That he could reason that it was better to let johnny work on his hind loose that to battle with his foot in the hobble. HE KNEW THE DIFFERENCE. This little episode taught me a lot. First it showed definitely that they will choose the path of least resistance. If at any time the owner/farrier/trainer gives up first, the animal will learn that they can get their way. Johnny gave him a wall that Adam could not surmount, so he gave in......just like your donkey showed signs of doing.

I also figured out that if johnny could get all the animals to submit and let them pick up their feet, there was not reason why I could not. One month ago, they would not let me close to doing that. So the last time, right after Johnny came, and we got them all trimmed, (with some battle on the other small standards) I picked right up where Johnny left off. I went out the next evening and started picking up their feet.

The old jennet would not let us touch her feet. EXCEPT THAT ONE NIGHT SHE HAD GOTTEN HER FEET STUCK IN WIRE. She knew that I was cutting her free, so she stood there like a statue while I cut the wire off. SHE KNEW THE DIFFERENCE and the only reason she was fussing was that she could, and i would not fight her about it.
So this first night, I told myself i would not give up. Just one goal. Pick up her front foot and be able to hold it there. She tried everything from jumping up to putting all of her weight on me. I didn't give up, was firm, but soft like johnny. Just unemotional and steadfast. Finally I got her to the point where she would let me hold her foot, and i gave her a carrot. that was the first night. second night the same, but the other front. third night I did the rear and she kicked. I smacked her then loved her, she gave up and we are good now. I can do all with her soft.

They will put up a fuss if they think you will give up. Someone once told me that you have to have the airs that no matter what happens, you will have the victory in the end. You have to give the appearance that you will stand there till hell freezes over. It sounds like you have that gumption, and I want to encourage and help you however I can. I've been in your boat. You have that determination. It will take some time. Each time it will be shorter, because the donks will usually take off from where you left them.
SOMETIMES THERE WILL BE SETBACKS.

The other night I had one. Although the big mammoth jack had been letting me pick all his feet for a few times without any problems, the other night he fussed about his rear. While holding it up, he kicked it out to make me let go, I held on, he kicked harder and finally sent me flying back six feet.
I got up, smacked his real hard with an open hand on the withers, and he looked at me like he was sorry. But he was still fussy, so I went and got THE ROPE. Tied it around him like Johnny did. roped his hind, pulled it up, let Adam kick at it a few times, looked at him square in the eyes, and Adam knew he had to submit. Let the hind out of rope and went back and pick up his rear, stretched it out so he knew, and picked his hoof. He never fussed on the other side either. So he knew about that rope! He remembered!

Hope these long stories help you in understanding you own animal.
HVR

[muttduck]

This guy seems to have had a bad experience with people, and the farrier visit seems to have reinforced his feelings of mistrust. I wish your farrier would have had a little more patience and inginuity instead of going to roping.



First suggestion - read everything you can on gentling mustangs or BLM burros.
http://www.mustangs4us.com/burros!.htm
http://www.blm.gov/pgdata/etc/medial...-friends-1.pdf

Second, be willing to spend time, and only make baby steps.

Start off with taking a bale of hay, or a chair, and sit in the middle of his pen reading a book (or other activity that takes your eyes off of him and occupies your time) and let him realize that your presence there isn't always something to do with him, or trying to catch/touch him.

He may come up, he may not. Don't look at him, and don't insist he comes.

If he comes up to sniff, keep to yourself, don't reach for him, just ignore him. He needs to know that you are nothing to fear.

Eventually, you can try taking a treat or a little grain in with you, to have near your side. Again, don't reach it out to him, let him find it by sniffing you out, and having to come near you to get it. If he doesn't come close enough, no big deal, just try again another day.

With donkeys, you almost have to let them think that everything "is their idea". Coming to you is his idea, being scratched is his idea.

If you can imagine a horse being like a dog, fairly willing to please and do what you ask... then imagine a donkey like a cat, wanting to do things on their terms, but yet, eventually doing what you ask without realizing you're the one asking to do it.

It's okay if he's not perfect for the farrier - that will come with time. However your farrier needs to be willing to work around the mistrust in a way as not to cause the mistrust to deepen. If your farrier isn't willing, then perhaps the donkey needs a new farrier. Yes, farriers are busy people, but a good farrier is willing to take the time to teach the animal that he's not the bad guy.

In the worst case scenario, once you have your donkey coming up to you, and trusting your hands on him...

If you feel safe enough to pick up his feet, you can always run a light grade rasp over it once a day, to help prevent the farrier from coming out so often, as well as reinforcing that playing with the feet isn't going to hurt him.

Just be careful - donkeys have no warning, and are lightning fast with their feet.


For our jenny, I have my hubby hold her head with a bucket of grain to preoocupy her while I rasp her feet. We do the same with her filly.

[HighValleyRanch]

So back to your situation.
Have you tried bringing out a carrot to see if he comes on his own?

Don't work with his feet yet, if he is that nervous about even letting you halter him. Work on being able to walk up to him any time first. If he thinks there is going to be a big battle, he will avoid that by keeping away.

The first big goal is to be able to make him stand while you approach. since he is in a pen, and haltered, this will make it easier.
DO NO USE A ROPE. This will only cause the fight and flight syndrome.

I have a jennet that is like that. The first few times, I could not even get close if she knew I was gong to halter her. But this is how i did it and it works everytime for me. My goal is to be able to do it in a big field, but we will have to work up to it. Otherwise she will get away and learn that she can.

It's sort of like donkey whispering, as my farrier said when he first saw me do it. You use tension against being soft. So I get her headed into a corner. ( now it works even against a fence with both sides open for her to escape). a corner for now. Be careful to watch for kicking signs. if he kicks be firm and let him know it. No signs of kicking, but be ready to come back down to being soft, the instant he settles down. You will have to learn to read the difference between his anxiety stage and his softening. Do not try to approach his rear, approach his side. If he turns his back to you, move youself around to his side.

She will start to take off in one direction, and at about ten feet away, I will head her off. But the instant she stops, I stop and I am relaxed the whole time. She runs the other way, I head her off and she stops. If she get away, I just follow her to some other corner. This way, she knows I am NOT GIVING UP UNTIL HELL FREEZES OVER!LOL At some point, it might be a half hour to one minute, she will give up. Now it's only a couple of time and she submits, but for you, it might be a while. DO NOT GIVE UP. otherwise you are training him to get away. Finally he will stand there tired and more happy not to move around. You cannot walk right up.

What I did was to turn my back and just stand there while she was coming down from her anxiety and flight syndrome. The key is that they are happier being relaxed than anxious. Then SLOWLY, i would take one step back and check back over my should that 1. she wasn't going to turn and kick and 2. that she was still soft. Stand there. take a step back. Stand there, slowly take a step back. If at any time, he runs off, do it all over again. try to head him off.
Finally, at some point I was able to reach back, (keeping myself to her side) and touch her. She would flinch when I initially touched her, but after touching her, she would calm down. Then I would slowly back up to her side, and then gently reach my right arm around her muzzle and guide the halter up. The whole time she is shivering, but submitting. after the halter was on, i would just love and calm her down.

The key was by having my back towards her, she allowed me to approach. If I walked up facing her, I was the predator. Now she will allow me to head her off a couple of times, I gently walk up and once I touch her, she submits.

Now, if I were in your shoes, I would do it this way. i would go in the pen, and head him into a corner. If he runs one way, head him off, even to the point of running. Make him stop. If he runs the other way use your arms to head him off and your ENERGY! Like voodo. Don't worry about scaring him, just be relaxed and use your spirit to talk to him and make him know that you are directing his actions. When he comes down to calm, just stand there and be relaxed while he is. Just let him know that he is standing there because you have made him. That is enough for lesson one, and he doesn't even know that it is a lesson. That way, if it doesn't work out for you, he hasn't won anything. You are just testing the waters to see if you can get him to react by your actions.

lesson two:
do the same as above, but make him stand there in the corner and work up to getting five feet away. When you can do that, and he is standing there calmly, you have won the battle for that stage. Do it a few times during the day. When you can do this everytime, move on to the next.

lesson three:
do as above, but be able to calmly work you way back and touch him. Don't demand anything else except that you may touch him and have him relax down. Try turning your back to him and see if he is more likely to let you get close than by facing him. It's different for each animal, but it worked for me.

lesson four:
as above, but be able to touch and stroke him and work slowly up to his neck and face. Do not grab the halter at this point, but work around his head and neck, and then finally be able to click the lead on his halter.

see if this helps at all.
It's only how I would approach it, your milage may vary.
Or then of course the rope a dope might work just as well.
It sounds like he was coming up to you and telling you something.

The first time i saw a horse whisperer, he did the same by round penning and applying constant pressure until the animal knew that he was in command. The at some point the guy released the pressure with the horse giving the right submission signs of licking, and the trainer stood in the middle of the pen, turned his back and the horse walked right up to his shoulder. He turned his back as a signal that it was OK for the horse to come in. Turning the back is like body language that you are not threatening nor afraid. For my donkeys, when I approach them, and them scatter off, when i just stand there close to them, and turn my back, they eventually want to come over to see what is up. They are curious by nature.

Hope any of this helps you!
Keep up posted.

[Slim Pikkens]

Perhaps withhold his hay until you take a bale into his pen to sit on. (or a chair and a few flakes) If he wants to eat, he'll have to approach you. As Muttduck says, read a book and pay no attention. It's tempting to touch him. I'd just move an arm, shift my weight and see how he reacts, without looking directly at him. Keep in mind an action may need to be repeated a min. of three times for him to figure out what's going on. So do the bale thing for 3 days, perhaps offering a treat after a while. By the third day he may allow you to rub his forehead but I wouldn't ask for more than that. Since he has no concept of time, you can take your chair/bale into the pen at both feedings.

[Brownie_GA]

Donkeys are peculiar creatures, at least in my experience. I have three, and all of them are as sweet as can be, and want to be trusting, but for some reason, they all have a slight trepidation about them whenever anyone approaches them. They are very loving animals, but super nervous natured. I know what you mean about getting their hooves trimmed. It takes slight sedation to get than done around here...at least to get a thorough job of it.

Don't give up on the little guy...he will turn out to be such a loyal friend in the end. Good luck with him!

[SaddleTrail]

Thank you sooooo much for the tips and advice!! I am willing to try it all.

HVR, thank you for understanding what is going on with Jasper.

My Papa Daddy always told me I was so stubborn even a mule couldn't move me, so guess it is time to start using his words hehe.

I have carrots, apples, stale marshmellows and grapes, I smash those before giving to him. So there is no shortage of treats.

I have to leave his halter on all the time, he is safe in the pen with it on. The only reason it was off and tangled around his feet was stupid me left the lead rope on to make it easier to catch him and he stepped on it and pulled the halter off.

Ive sat for hours just talking to him or the goat. I will try everything I can to get him gentled.

[HighValleyRanch]

I'm in Northern CA, Lake county to be specific..

Where are you?

Don't give him the food as bribes.....well maybe only a little in the beginning, but try to use the treats as rewards for what they do.

I won't give Adam any treats until AFTER he does the stuff correctly.
But I sometimes break the rule...
As when the last session in standing up in the stirrups for the first few times, I use the carrot to distract him, then changed to giving him the carrot AFTER he let me do it.

Good Luck!

[SaddleTrail]

I am in Happy Valley outside of Redding ~S~

I am waiting for my pain pills to kick in before I go out to work with him today.
I forgot gloves yesterday and my hands are a bit skinned up heheh.

I have my mini stud in with Jasper and I am hoping it helps calm him down as well. He sees how ShotGun is so loving and calm.

[HighValleyRanch]

Yeah, that is a little far for my farrier to travel.
If you were closer I would have highly suggested him.

One month for the farrier to come back?
Did he do a complete job, or did the problems prevent him for doing everything. Ours comes about every six to eight weeks depending on the time of year and growth. One month is pretty soon, unless he was taking them down a little at a time.

[SaddleTrail]

Jaspers feet were so bad and long he did what he could and it looked really good. They kinda look like horses hooves, not the more upright hooves.
Dave does my minis feet as well and never has a problem with him.
I bought the tools I need to do them my self for the mini. I havent tried as yet but will pretty soon.

Tonight when I went out to feed he came straight up to the gate and pushed shotgun out of the way and lifted his nose for me to kiss!! Just stuns me that he is like that when I am on the outside of the gate and he is a monster when I am on the inside with him!
When he takes a treat, his mouth is so soft and gentle, I just love it. Shotgun tries to bite the treat instead of lipping it first.

No, my hubby says he has to go, not the farrier. The farrier was really good with him, he gave a treat after wards and petted Jasper allot.
Hubby is scared to death Jasper is going to hurt me because of my health.
Ba humbug! Ive been kicked before many times. I make bloody sure I am well out of the way of his feet.

[HighValleyRanch]

Were you able to work with him yesterday?

If he comes over to you while you are outside the fence, have you tried clicking the lead rope on while he's up to you.

Have you tried just draping the lead rope over your shoulder and working around in the pen, so that they think it's part of your attire.

I know that if I walk up to Belle with the lead in my hand, it freaks her out, but if i drape the lead over my shoulder and act like I am not trying to catch her, she will come up sometimes.

[SaddleTrail]

Oh yea, have tried it all.
When I had him tied to the high line in my front yard, I could walk up to him if I was real slow and if I pulled the lead while he is tied he would stop pulling back.
At one point I even brushed his back with my hand. I kept him tied there for two weeks to make sure he didnt have anything wrong that my mini may catch. So I petted him allot and spent time with him. One time he allowed me to run my hand down to his chest and then exploded. But ever since he has been in the pen he wont let me do anything with him.
In the pen and its about 20 x26 he is just wild. So I am thinking of keeping him on the high line for a week, then in the pen for a week.

I walked him on the lead every day to get him more exercise, it took us a while to go even a few feet but at least he did it.

I also forgot to mention, his left eye looks like it was hurt at one time. The pigment at the very corner is all pink and goes down a few inches. He is extremely leery of you moving your hands around his face.

The second picture you can see more of his eye and the pinkness of it.

[Foot]

Hello..Just keep up the good work In seeing the pic we thought It was our Mini Jack heres his pic

How old is your Jack? Is he Gelded? Gelding him might help to settle him down. Our Jack loves to be brushed more than anything, We were fortunate he is sweet as pie and loves to be petted. He is not crazy about his feet but we have a doll of a farrier (female) who fell in love with him on first sight. Just be gentle and firm and let the donkey be right...

[SaddleTrail]

Yes he is gelded. That was the only truth they told me about him.
I was suckered but he needed me so thats cool. I just want him to have a better life then just standing in a pen.