unidentified lameness

lbequ4002 · 09-03-2008, 02:16 PM

My horse was a little off about a month ago in his left hind a couple days after getting new shoes. He was a little back sore too and it's not from riding because he hasn't been ridden. I took him to the vet they decided it was a soft tissue injury and several x-rays and $500 later they said to give him 3 weeks off with some steroids. He got new shoes again yesterday and today someone came and rode him for me and he was better but still not 100%. His back seems fine he's just not quite right. He's been off strenuous work for about 3 months now and had no visible injury. Anyone have any ideas?

AngelPA · 09-03-2008, 02:23 PM

...possible stifle injury??

**seerfarm** · 09-03-2008, 02:48 PM

Soft Tissue injuries depending on where they are located can take months sometimes to heal. Perhaps instead of a rider, maybe some round pen/light longe, longlining and in hand work to help lightly rehab for a few more weeks before going back to riding.

With this type of injury it is always good to make sure they are healthy and sound without rider's weight before being put back into work. It can help in minimizing the possibility of reinjury. Think of it as Physical Therapy.

pasopony · 09-03-2008, 03:25 PM

Good liniment rubdowns and massages will help as well. Slow easy exercise - especially some stretching - is very good for soft tissue damage. I would be hand-walking/trotting him and watching for stiffness. A little is fine to work the muscle, but too much can re-injure him.

kanoo32 · 09-03-2008, 03:34 PM

How about just some pasture time for a month or so, and see if that resolves the situation. The horse will not do more than he feels like doing and the injury, whatever it may be will be more likely to resolve itself on its own. I am not an advocate of any kind of forced exercise when a horse is not right.

EquineAlberta · 09-03-2008, 03:46 PM

Did you block him to isolate the place of the issue? How does he do on flexions? Some soft tissue injuries aren't repairable, some require treatment, and some require rest. X-rays don't often help with diagnosis of a soft tissue issue such as collateral damage, cartilege damage and such..unless they are to the extent that bone is involved. Blocking the leg isn't definative either, but it will give you a better idea of what area the issue is in, and may narrow it down. If you have access to an MRI machine that would be best, but there aren't may of those machines around!

I hope it is nothing serious.

Karen

vetjeanne · 09-03-2008, 03:55 PM

Why was his back sore and why was'nt he being ridden? What was the sign that his back was sore? Any ligament, muscle, tendon damage is best handled with physical therapy. A long lay off will result in a temp improvement followed by problems. Call your vet tell them your concerns and see what ideas or opinions on the matter they did see the orginial problem give them a chance to help. The saying take two pills and call me in the morning is true that sometimes in medicine response to treatment is diagnostic in some reguards.

lbequ4002 · 09-03-2008, 04:02 PM

The diagnosis was done by my problem vet I've posted about before who I won't be using again for sure. No he didn't block anything. The horse was fine on flexion on all 4 legs. He looked ouchy to me all over not just left hind and I really think it's his feet but the vet poo pooed that idea and just did x-rays and said well he couldn't find anything so it must be soft tissue. There was no swelling and no visible "injury" I've turned him out in the pasture now and he's looked fine. I lunged him the other day after the allotted amount of recovery time and he looked fine. But with a rider he's not quite right. I wanted to see if there was a difference u/s.

vetjeanene: He hasn't been ridden b/c I'm pregnant and can't ride not because of the injury initially. so he developed a sore back without any riding. That's another reason I think it could be in his feet but neither vet or farrier agree and he's fine with hoof testers. He is also the type of horse that looks much better while in work as far as muscle and body shape. When I stopped riding him he lost a lot of muscle.

EquineAlberta · 09-03-2008, 04:05 PM

I would try a chiroprator next then...or maybe a different saddle.

Did the vet x-ray randomly, or did he see places to focus his attention?

Karen

lbequ4002 · 09-03-2008, 04:06 PM

he was thinking a fractured splint bone and took 6 x-rays. No fractures.

AlbertaGirl · 09-03-2008, 04:09 PM

I'm a die hard chiropractor fanatic, so I'd have to say that I would definetly have a chiro check him out to rule out any type of issue they may be able to resolve. When the source of the problem is a bit of a mystery, I prefer to try to rule things out, and having had fantastic results many times over from chiros, would at least give it a try

. Could be ribs, vertabrae, maybe his poll, or even one hip... I know when my mare has pulled back, her hip goes ut, as well as her shoulder, and you'd swear she was actually lame. Chiro comes and puts her back together, and she's basically fine instantly

. Good luck, hope he'll be okay!

EquineAlberta · 09-03-2008, 04:22 PM

So he thought it was one particular leg that limped? Or he just wanted to pay for his x-ray machine? I guess what you describe and what the vet did, just don't make sense to me so it must be frustrating for you too.

Karen

vetjeanne · 09-03-2008, 04:31 PM

Sorry had to review old post. This started in late july with a shifting leg lameness. About 10 days later a sore back due to skin problems or both show up at about the same time? Now after a 3 to 4 week lay off his skin is better but the lameness is still present but not specific to one leg at any given time.Did the farrier have any problems in replaceing the shoes? What is the age of the horse? What is he used for trail,jumping ect.?

lbequ4002 · 09-04-2008, 08:08 AM

I got him in feb this year and was jumping him lightly and doing dressage. Not sure what he did before I got him. He's 8. Never had a single problem when he was in consistent work. Skin problem flared up big time when on steroids and is gone now. He is usually a little bad for the farrier but wasn't any worse than usual. He did seem a little more ouchy after his shoes tuesday. My vet bill for this one thing was almost $500 and pretty much inconclusive. This is the same vet who among other things told me I had a crypt and he needed surgery and then my other vet found both right away and gelded him normally. (not this horse) I had asked this vet about a chiro and to see if he worked with one because I don't know of any in my area. He said he didn't believe in chiro in general for horses or people (I couldn't live w/o mine).
When worked lightly w/o a rider my horse looks fine so I'm wondering if I should gradually get him back in shape on the ground.

vetjeanne · 09-04-2008, 11:27 AM

Sounds like a good plan at this point.

EquineAlberta · 09-05-2008, 11:07 AM

I agree that working on his fitness from the ground sounds good too. ground driving and lunging over poles might be good to work on his back.

The fact that he is worse after getting his feet done makes me think it is his back too.

You might be able to get a book on equine massage or the TTEAM Touch therapy, which can help you look for muscle spasms and find muscle pain. As well, if you look at him from above (if possible) or behind, see if you can tell if he is loosing muscle more on one side than the other? Sore muscle might atrophy and you will notice uneveness.

Feeling the consistency of his various muscles for differences may also help you pinpoint the issue and let you know where he needs work. Muscles should feel like ground beef, not stringy or hard like overcooked steak.

Karen

Hideaway · 09-05-2008, 11:17 AM

Stupid question but do they have lymes disease in Fl? Your horse sounds like a thoroughbred I know. The horse was owned by a friend of mine and was never lame but just not "right" to ride. Several checks later my vet did a blood test and it was LD. May be worth checking into?

chris6351 · 09-05-2008, 12:00 PM

Have you tried a differant farrier? Maybe its the way he gets shod or something to do with the shoes/trim?

lbequ4002 · 09-05-2008, 05:25 PM

i'm looking into a new farrier. I just don't feel mine does a good job. I had this horse barefoot for several months when I first got him trying to get rid of a lot of excess toe and he was super sound to jump and everything even with less than perfect feet. His feet actually look worse to me shod now. I want to find the right farrier though and am kind of shopping around. I'm really thinking about going with a barefoot trimmer if I can find one. My current guy is nice and actually on time but I've had better farriers.

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09-03-2008, 02:16 PM
lbequ4002 Yearling Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Central AL Posts: 761	unidentified lameness My horse was a little off about a month ago in his left hind a couple days after getting new shoes. He was a little back sore too and it's not from riding because he hasn't been ridden. I took him to the vet they decided it was a soft tissue injury and several x-rays and $500 later they said to give him 3 weeks off with some steroids. He got new shoes again yesterday and today someone came and rode him for me and he was better but still not 100%. His back seems fine he's just not quite right. He's been off strenuous work for about 3 months now and had no visible injury. Anyone have any ideas?

09-03-2008, 02:23 PM
AngelPA Weanling Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: PA Posts: 371	...possible stifle injury??

09-03-2008, 02:48 PM
seerfarm Super Moderator Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Portal, Ga Posts: 7,732	Soft Tissue injuries depending on where they are located can take months sometimes to heal. Perhaps instead of a rider, maybe some round pen/light longe, longlining and in hand work to help lightly rehab for a few more weeks before going back to riding. With this type of injury it is always good to make sure they are healthy and sound without rider's weight before being put back into work. It can help in minimizing the possibility of reinjury. Think of it as Physical Therapy. __________________ "To know the road ahead, ask those coming back".

09-03-2008, 03:25 PM
pasopony Yearling Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 811	Good liniment rubdowns and massages will help as well. Slow easy exercise - especially some stretching - is very good for soft tissue damage. I would be hand-walking/trotting him and watching for stiffness. A little is fine to work the muscle, but too much can re-injure him. __________________ Horses are not my whole life, but horses make my life whole.

09-03-2008, 03:34 PM
kanoo32 Started Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Florida Posts: 2,362	How about just some pasture time for a month or so, and see if that resolves the situation. The horse will not do more than he feels like doing and the injury, whatever it may be will be more likely to resolve itself on its own. I am not an advocate of any kind of forced exercise when a horse is not right. __________________ Even if your on the right track, you'll get run over if you just sit there!

09-03-2008, 03:46 PM
EquineAlberta Seasoned Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Alberta, Canada Posts: 4,425	Did you block him to isolate the place of the issue? How does he do on flexions? Some soft tissue injuries aren't repairable, some require treatment, and some require rest. X-rays don't often help with diagnosis of a soft tissue issue such as collateral damage, cartilege damage and such..unless they are to the extent that bone is involved. Blocking the leg isn't definative either, but it will give you a better idea of what area the issue is in, and may narrow it down. If you have access to an MRI machine that would be best, but there aren't may of those machines around! I hope it is nothing serious. Karen __________________ Hillside Stable, Ardrossan, AB Do unto others as you would have them do unto you...is it really that hard?

09-03-2008, 03:55 PM
vetjeanne Halter broke Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: arkansas Posts: 55	Why was his back sore and why was'nt he being ridden? What was the sign that his back was sore? Any ligament, muscle, tendon damage is best handled with physical therapy. A long lay off will result in a temp improvement followed by problems. Call your vet tell them your concerns and see what ideas or opinions on the matter they did see the orginial problem give them a chance to help. The saying take two pills and call me in the morning is true that sometimes in medicine response to treatment is diagnostic in some reguards. __________________ I will lift up mine eyes unto the hills... www.arkyhorse.com

09-03-2008, 04:02 PM
lbequ4002 Yearling Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Central AL Posts: 761	The diagnosis was done by my problem vet I've posted about before who I won't be using again for sure. No he didn't block anything. The horse was fine on flexion on all 4 legs. He looked ouchy to me all over not just left hind and I really think it's his feet but the vet poo pooed that idea and just did x-rays and said well he couldn't find anything so it must be soft tissue. There was no swelling and no visible "injury" I've turned him out in the pasture now and he's looked fine. I lunged him the other day after the allotted amount of recovery time and he looked fine. But with a rider he's not quite right. I wanted to see if there was a difference u/s. vetjeanene: He hasn't been ridden b/c I'm pregnant and can't ride not because of the injury initially. so he developed a sore back without any riding. That's another reason I think it could be in his feet but neither vet or farrier agree and he's fine with hoof testers. He is also the type of horse that looks much better while in work as far as muscle and body shape. When I stopped riding him he lost a lot of muscle. Last edited by lbequ4002 : 09-03-2008 at 04:05 PM.

09-03-2008, 04:05 PM
EquineAlberta Seasoned Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Alberta, Canada Posts: 4,425	I would try a chiroprator next then...or maybe a different saddle. Did the vet x-ray randomly, or did he see places to focus his attention? Karen __________________ Hillside Stable, Ardrossan, AB Do unto others as you would have them do unto you...is it really that hard?

09-03-2008, 04:06 PM
lbequ4002 Yearling Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Central AL Posts: 761	he was thinking a fractured splint bone and took 6 x-rays. No fractures.

09-03-2008, 04:09 PM
AlbertaGirl Greenbroke Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Alberta Posts: 3,263	I'm a die hard chiropractor fanatic, so I'd have to say that I would definetly have a chiro check him out to rule out any type of issue they may be able to resolve. When the source of the problem is a bit of a mystery, I prefer to try to rule things out, and having had fantastic results many times over from chiros, would at least give it a try . Could be ribs, vertabrae, maybe his poll, or even one hip... I know when my mare has pulled back, her hip goes ut, as well as her shoulder, and you'd swear she was actually lame. Chiro comes and puts her back together, and she's basically fine instantly . Good luck, hope he'll be okay! __________________ Some people say horses don't have a sense of humor... they obviously haven't met mine yet ;o)

09-03-2008, 04:22 PM
EquineAlberta Seasoned Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Alberta, Canada Posts: 4,425	So he thought it was one particular leg that limped? Or he just wanted to pay for his x-ray machine? I guess what you describe and what the vet did, just don't make sense to me so it must be frustrating for you too. Karen __________________ Hillside Stable, Ardrossan, AB Do unto others as you would have them do unto you...is it really that hard?

09-03-2008, 04:31 PM
vetjeanne Halter broke Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: arkansas Posts: 55	Sorry had to review old post. This started in late july with a shifting leg lameness. About 10 days later a sore back due to skin problems or both show up at about the same time? Now after a 3 to 4 week lay off his skin is better but the lameness is still present but not specific to one leg at any given time.Did the farrier have any problems in replaceing the shoes? What is the age of the horse? What is he used for trail,jumping ect.? __________________ I will lift up mine eyes unto the hills... www.arkyhorse.com

09-04-2008, 08:08 AM
lbequ4002 Yearling Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Central AL Posts: 761	I got him in feb this year and was jumping him lightly and doing dressage. Not sure what he did before I got him. He's 8. Never had a single problem when he was in consistent work. Skin problem flared up big time when on steroids and is gone now. He is usually a little bad for the farrier but wasn't any worse than usual. He did seem a little more ouchy after his shoes tuesday. My vet bill for this one thing was almost $500 and pretty much inconclusive. This is the same vet who among other things told me I had a crypt and he needed surgery and then my other vet found both right away and gelded him normally. (not this horse) I had asked this vet about a chiro and to see if he worked with one because I don't know of any in my area. He said he didn't believe in chiro in general for horses or people (I couldn't live w/o mine). When worked lightly w/o a rider my horse looks fine so I'm wondering if I should gradually get him back in shape on the ground.

09-04-2008, 11:27 AM
vetjeanne Halter broke Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: arkansas Posts: 55	Sounds like a good plan at this point. __________________ I will lift up mine eyes unto the hills... www.arkyhorse.com

09-05-2008, 11:07 AM
EquineAlberta Seasoned Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Alberta, Canada Posts: 4,425	I agree that working on his fitness from the ground sounds good too. ground driving and lunging over poles might be good to work on his back. The fact that he is worse after getting his feet done makes me think it is his back too. You might be able to get a book on equine massage or the TTEAM Touch therapy, which can help you look for muscle spasms and find muscle pain. As well, if you look at him from above (if possible) or behind, see if you can tell if he is loosing muscle more on one side than the other? Sore muscle might atrophy and you will notice uneveness. Feeling the consistency of his various muscles for differences may also help you pinpoint the issue and let you know where he needs work. Muscles should feel like ground beef, not stringy or hard like overcooked steak. Karen __________________ Hillside Stable, Ardrossan, AB Do unto others as you would have them do unto you...is it really that hard?

09-05-2008, 11:17 AM
Hideaway Coming two Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: PA Posts: 1,935	Stupid question but do they have lymes disease in Fl? Your horse sounds like a thoroughbred I know. The horse was owned by a friend of mine and was never lame but just not "right" to ride. Several checks later my vet did a blood test and it was LD. May be worth checking into? __________________ Well Behaved Women Rarely Make History

09-05-2008, 12:00 PM
chris6351 Halter broke Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: New England Posts: 102	Have you tried a differant farrier? Maybe its the way he gets shod or something to do with the shoes/trim? __________________ Chris "THERE IS NO KEY TO HAPPINESS, THE DOOR IS ALWAYS OPEN"

09-05-2008, 05:25 PM
lbequ4002 Yearling Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Central AL Posts: 761	i'm looking into a new farrier. I just don't feel mine does a good job. I had this horse barefoot for several months when I first got him trying to get rid of a lot of excess toe and he was super sound to jump and everything even with less than perfect feet. His feet actually look worse to me shod now. I want to find the right farrier though and am kind of shopping around. I'm really thinking about going with a barefoot trimmer if I can find one. My current guy is nice and actually on time but I've had better farriers.