feeding diatomacious earth as fly preventative

secondhandranch · 08-26-2008, 10:12 PM

has any one heard or tried feeding food grade dia-earth to horse/livestock as a natural remedy for pests? how about apple cider vinegar? has this worked for anyone? are there any health affects from this? the folks at the feed store talked me into trying out the dia-earth. says she uses it on her barnful except for a boarders horse and says u can tell who gets it and who doesn't.

reiningfan · 08-26-2008, 10:24 PM

It works not just as fly prevention, but is also a great addition to a deworming program. We started using it a few years ago and our fecal counts were the lowest they have ever been.
If you just have a few horses on your place and have no neighbors with livestock, it works better than if you also have other livestock, unless you feed the diatomaceous earth to them as well. And if you have close neighbors with livestock, it still works, but not always quite as well.
That's my experiences with it, but some people may very well disagree.

secondhandranch · 08-26-2008, 10:38 PM

the bag doesn't give dosage amounts. i've heard several opinions. what's urs? i have been using 2 heaping "coffee measure" scoopies per big horse (1000-&under) and 1 just overful for the lil uns. they also say use on dogs, goats, etc just about anything that will take it. ever heard of the vinegar thing?

reiningfan · 08-27-2008, 12:31 AM

I've heard of using the cider venegar, but never done it myself. Some people really like it, but it sounds like you need to have your horses on it for a while before you notice the positive effects.
As for the dosage for the diatomaceous earth, I just feed 1/4 cup per horse with their oats. It seems to be doing the trick. If my fecal counts are higher in between standard deworming, I add a bit more. I still have my horses on a deworming program and do fecal egg counts through my vet. We use the diatamaceous earth as an extra guarantee against worms. We simply don't have any. I've also heard that most horses will eat it without needing oil or molasses to keep it sticking to the grain, but I prefer to add a little oil to my oats on the harder keepers anyhow. I use a small amount of water to adhere it to the oats for the rest. Some people worry about feeding what amounts to dust to their horses. If this is a worry, by all means wet it down.

Soliae · 08-27-2008, 06:59 AM

There have been several real studies done showing that there are no real effects from that dia-earth stuff. It's a popular myth from the eco-people. I sure wouldn't feed it to my horses - I've heard some feed and some sprinkle it on the ground - just seems like another scam to me.

Texas Paints N Arabs · 08-27-2008, 10:13 AM

I feed dia-earth to my personal horses and any time I have had fecals done they are always negative. So it might be a myth but it sure seems to be working for my guys.

reiningfan · 08-27-2008, 10:44 AM

I find it's the best working myth around. Even if it doesn't work for fly control, it's hard to argue with fecal egg testing.

Texas Paints N Arabs · 08-27-2008, 12:10 PM

My horses are all fat and healthy. My stallion who is 4 now has been chemically wormed once a year since I got him at 7 months and has been on dia-earth every day and he looks great, no worms/eggs. I have been very pleased with it. I did start using one called Natural Occuring Mineral Source since it had other stuff in it as well but it still has DE in it.

ahlihaff · 08-27-2008, 01:21 PM

I thought it was not a good idea to completely wipe out all types of worms. Is that inaccurate? I remember this from a clinic I went to. I could be wrong.

They claim the product is wonderful for human consumption also. Seems like it might be worth trying as long as it is not harmful to the animals.

I just looked dia-earth up on internet and found this dosage info:

Animal Use - Suggested Feeding and Application Rates:
Animal
Suggested Rate
Beef Cattle
1% of total weight of dry ration 5% in grain
Dairy Cattle
1% of total weight of dry ration
Calves
4 grams in morning milk per calf or 2 oz. per day in feed
Chickens
5% in feed, use at full strength in dusting boxes
Hogs
2% of total feed ration, dust or spray on bedding and animals
Horses
5 ounces (1 cup) in daily feed ration
Sheep
1% in ground grains 1 part Diatomaceous Earth to 2 parts T-M salt
Goats
1% in grain, 5% per bushel of feed: up to 50% in T-M salt

ToveroMom · 08-27-2008, 01:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Texas Paints N Arabs

My horses are all fat and healthy. My stallion who is 4 now has been chemically wormed once a year since I got him at 7 months and has been on dia-earth every day and he looks great, no worms/eggs. I have been very pleased with it. I did start using one called Natural Occuring Mineral Source since it had other stuff in it as well but it still has DE in it.

So has the efficacy against all types of worms been tested? do you run your own fecals/how often? It seems odd that just diatoms can do a 100% complete job of worm kill when some worms are so tough.
I mean it sounds great but pardon my initial reaction of "Hmm I wonder"
I did look online for research and found it sadly lacking or not the same results as you find..
That is my honest reaction.
Be glad to hear your views on it.

Texas Paints N Arabs · 08-27-2008, 01:39 PM

No I don't run my own fecals. When my vet is out for something routine I have a fecal run. Most of my first information about DE came from www.de36.com
The people that we bought our first arab from were partners in the company. They put their horses on it and did studies about the product, to what lengths I do not know. All of their horses always looked great. They have several testimonials from other people in this area that have used it with great results as well.
I guess it is one of those things that people either believe or don't. I know a lot of people that think beet pulp is crap and won't feed it.
Of course you can run a fecal and you might not find any worms and do another fecal the next day and find some. I learned that from a local vet. Just depends on the life stage of the worm and other factors such as stress load etc too. So fecals are only a starting point for detecting worms. I go off of coat, wormy belly etc.

eclectic · 08-27-2008, 01:50 PM

DE, I love it. I use it on my dogs, my cats and my Horses. With the horses I feed a cup in their feed 2x's aday for 2 days every other month. I add it to their feed and add water to keep the dust down. they eat it with no problem, I worm my colt daily with it with no harmful effects. The diatoms are microscopically very sharp and lacerate worms, fleas and bugs in general. They in turn die from a type of exsanguination [not of blood but bodily fluids] You can even put in on your pets and massage it down to their skin and it will killl the fleas on them. also it's great if you have flea infestation to work into the carpet and vacuum, repeat 2x's 10 days apart and it will break the cycle and you'll be flea free. I must say that Mule Team Borax works better in the house because it doesn't produce a dust cloud and works in just as well.

I know of some dressage trainers who put it out in containers in the pastures and the horses will eat it freely as they need it.

If it's placebo effect I'll take it. I just know it works. Cheap and non poisonous to animals.

I even have a friend who grew up in rural Tenn, vegetarian mind you. and her Mom used to give the kids a teaspoon of DE weekly to keep worms/parasites out of their systems. You can get parasites from being barefoot out in the dirt. Great stuff. this was over 45 years ago

version1955 · 08-27-2008, 01:56 PM

Diatoms have very sharp little bodies made of silica, so if the worms are in lifestages where they are vulnerable to punctures and scratches, then it will work 100% of the time. But I'm thinking encysted worms or other parasites won't be affected because they aren't susceptible. And I believe the encysted stage isn't found in a fecal, but I could be wrong. And it could be the fecal test isn't looking for cysts only for adults

ToveroMom · 08-27-2008, 02:02 PM

TP&A thanks for the response. That is very true about running fecals and missing worms depending on their life cycle at that moment-particularly tapes. BUT that does not neccesarily that your slick and potbelly-free horse may not have worms.
It may indeed be a decent supplement to a worming program but I would err on the side of caution with frequent fecals and supplemental chemical wormers.
I am familiar with DE as I used to live in Lompoc CA and a lot of DE is mined there. Folks claim many things for the DE for many things.
I use it to sop up mud and pee holes in the stall-works great at that. Amazing to watch it work-just be sure to not sprinkle while the horse is in the stall as inhaled DE is not great on any living thing.

.

reiningfan · 08-27-2008, 02:11 PM

I still use dewormers. I just use the DE as an addition to my program. I do not do my own fecal egg count. The vet does ours.
If you consider the low cost of the stuff and the fact that those of us who use it are more than happy with the results, which we have backed up by our vets, and the fact that none of us has had health problems as a result of using it, what's the problem?
Feel free to disagree. My vet didn't believe it would work. We did VERY frequent testing at first. Now even he agrees that the DE works. I use it rather than a daily feed through dewormer. I still use chemical dewormers just in case of encysted worms or any eggs, but not quite as often as I used to.

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08-26-2008, 10:12 PM
secondhandranch Newborn Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: homosassa, fl Posts: 32	feeding diatomacious earth as fly preventative has any one heard or tried feeding food grade dia-earth to horse/livestock as a natural remedy for pests? how about apple cider vinegar? has this worked for anyone? are there any health affects from this? the folks at the feed store talked me into trying out the dia-earth. says she uses it on her barnful except for a boarders horse and says u can tell who gets it and who doesn't.

08-26-2008, 10:24 PM
reiningfan Yearling Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Western Manitoba, Canada Posts: 516	It works not just as fly prevention, but is also a great addition to a deworming program. We started using it a few years ago and our fecal counts were the lowest they have ever been. If you just have a few horses on your place and have no neighbors with livestock, it works better than if you also have other livestock, unless you feed the diatomaceous earth to them as well. And if you have close neighbors with livestock, it still works, but not always quite as well. That's my experiences with it, but some people may very well disagree.

08-26-2008, 10:38 PM
secondhandranch Newborn Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: homosassa, fl Posts: 32	the bag doesn't give dosage amounts. i've heard several opinions. what's urs? i have been using 2 heaping "coffee measure" scoopies per big horse (1000-&under) and 1 just overful for the lil uns. they also say use on dogs, goats, etc just about anything that will take it. ever heard of the vinegar thing?

08-27-2008, 12:31 AM
reiningfan Yearling Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Western Manitoba, Canada Posts: 516	I've heard of using the cider venegar, but never done it myself. Some people really like it, but it sounds like you need to have your horses on it for a while before you notice the positive effects. As for the dosage for the diatomaceous earth, I just feed 1/4 cup per horse with their oats. It seems to be doing the trick. If my fecal counts are higher in between standard deworming, I add a bit more. I still have my horses on a deworming program and do fecal egg counts through my vet. We use the diatamaceous earth as an extra guarantee against worms. We simply don't have any. I've also heard that most horses will eat it without needing oil or molasses to keep it sticking to the grain, but I prefer to add a little oil to my oats on the harder keepers anyhow. I use a small amount of water to adhere it to the oats for the rest. Some people worry about feeding what amounts to dust to their horses. If this is a worry, by all means wet it down.

08-27-2008, 06:59 AM
Soliae Halter broke Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Tennessee Posts: 127	There have been several real studies done showing that there are no real effects from that dia-earth stuff. It's a popular myth from the eco-people. I sure wouldn't feed it to my horses - I've heard some feed and some sprinkle it on the ground - just seems like another scam to me. __________________ Click on the Eggs and Hatchlings to Help them Hatch and Grow!

08-27-2008, 10:13 AM
Texas Paints N Arabs Long Yearling Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Texas Posts: 1,169	I feed dia-earth to my personal horses and any time I have had fecals done they are always negative. So it might be a myth but it sure seems to be working for my guys. __________________ Horses help take us to a place which we cannot reach by ourselves

08-27-2008, 10:44 AM
reiningfan Yearling Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Western Manitoba, Canada Posts: 516	I find it's the best working myth around. Even if it doesn't work for fly control, it's hard to argue with fecal egg testing.

08-27-2008, 12:10 PM
Texas Paints N Arabs Long Yearling Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Texas Posts: 1,169	My horses are all fat and healthy. My stallion who is 4 now has been chemically wormed once a year since I got him at 7 months and has been on dia-earth every day and he looks great, no worms/eggs. I have been very pleased with it. I did start using one called Natural Occuring Mineral Source since it had other stuff in it as well but it still has DE in it. __________________ Horses help take us to a place which we cannot reach by ourselves

08-27-2008, 01:21 PM
ahlihaff Greenbroke Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Western MA Posts: 3,584	I thought it was not a good idea to completely wipe out all types of worms. Is that inaccurate? I remember this from a clinic I went to. I could be wrong. They claim the product is wonderful for human consumption also. Seems like it might be worth trying as long as it is not harmful to the animals. I just looked dia-earth up on internet and found this dosage info: Animal Use - Suggested Feeding and Application Rates: Animal Suggested Rate Beef Cattle 1% of total weight of dry ration 5% in grain Dairy Cattle 1% of total weight of dry ration Calves 4 grams in morning milk per calf or 2 oz. per day in feed Chickens 5% in feed, use at full strength in dusting boxes Hogs 2% of total feed ration, dust or spray on bedding and animals Horses 5 ounces (1 cup) in daily feed ration Sheep 1% in ground grains 1 part Diatomaceous Earth to 2 parts T-M salt Goats 1% in grain, 5% per bushel of feed: up to 50% in T-M salt

08-27-2008, 01:39 PM
Texas Paints N Arabs Long Yearling Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Texas Posts: 1,169	No I don't run my own fecals. When my vet is out for something routine I have a fecal run. Most of my first information about DE came from www.de36.com The people that we bought our first arab from were partners in the company. They put their horses on it and did studies about the product, to what lengths I do not know. All of their horses always looked great. They have several testimonials from other people in this area that have used it with great results as well. I guess it is one of those things that people either believe or don't. I know a lot of people that think beet pulp is crap and won't feed it. Of course you can run a fecal and you might not find any worms and do another fecal the next day and find some. I learned that from a local vet. Just depends on the life stage of the worm and other factors such as stress load etc too. So fecals are only a starting point for detecting worms. I go off of coat, wormy belly etc. __________________ Horses help take us to a place which we cannot reach by ourselves

08-27-2008, 01:50 PM
eclectic Weanling Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 323	DE, I love it. I use it on my dogs, my cats and my Horses. With the horses I feed a cup in their feed 2x's aday for 2 days every other month. I add it to their feed and add water to keep the dust down. they eat it with no problem, I worm my colt daily with it with no harmful effects. The diatoms are microscopically very sharp and lacerate worms, fleas and bugs in general. They in turn die from a type of exsanguination [not of blood but bodily fluids] You can even put in on your pets and massage it down to their skin and it will killl the fleas on them. also it's great if you have flea infestation to work into the carpet and vacuum, repeat 2x's 10 days apart and it will break the cycle and you'll be flea free. I must say that Mule Team Borax works better in the house because it doesn't produce a dust cloud and works in just as well. I know of some dressage trainers who put it out in containers in the pastures and the horses will eat it freely as they need it. If it's placebo effect I'll take it. I just know it works. Cheap and non poisonous to animals. I even have a friend who grew up in rural Tenn, vegetarian mind you. and her Mom used to give the kids a teaspoon of DE weekly to keep worms/parasites out of their systems. You can get parasites from being barefoot out in the dirt. Great stuff. this was over 45 years ago

08-27-2008, 01:56 PM
version1955 Kid Safe Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: out Posts: 6,490	Diatoms have very sharp little bodies made of silica, so if the worms are in lifestages where they are vulnerable to punctures and scratches, then it will work 100% of the time. But I'm thinking encysted worms or other parasites won't be affected because they aren't susceptible. And I believe the encysted stage isn't found in a fecal, but I could be wrong. And it could be the fecal test isn't looking for cysts only for adults __________________ If you can't master your emotions, how can you be the safe partner your horse needs you to be?

08-27-2008, 02:02 PM
ToveroMom Pasture Pet Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Cleveland TX Posts: 15,296	TP&A thanks for the response. That is very true about running fecals and missing worms depending on their life cycle at that moment-particularly tapes. BUT that does not neccesarily that your slick and potbelly-free horse may not have worms. It may indeed be a decent supplement to a worming program but I would err on the side of caution with frequent fecals and supplemental chemical wormers. I am familiar with DE as I used to live in Lompoc CA and a lot of DE is mined there. Folks claim many things for the DE for many things. I use it to sop up mud and pee holes in the stall-works great at that. Amazing to watch it work-just be sure to not sprinkle while the horse is in the stall as inhaled DE is not great on any living thing. . __________________ "In America,anyone can be President. That is one of the chances you take" Adlai Stevenson

08-27-2008, 02:11 PM
reiningfan Yearling Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Western Manitoba, Canada Posts: 516	I still use dewormers. I just use the DE as an addition to my program. I do not do my own fecal egg count. The vet does ours. If you consider the low cost of the stuff and the fact that those of us who use it are more than happy with the results, which we have backed up by our vets, and the fact that none of us has had health problems as a result of using it, what's the problem? Feel free to disagree. My vet didn't believe it would work. We did VERY frequent testing at first. Now even he agrees that the DE works. I use it rather than a daily feed through dewormer. I still use chemical dewormers just in case of encysted worms or any eggs, but not quite as often as I used to.