feed options

MVeventer · 01-30-2008, 05:46 PM

Okay folks,
I'm looking for a food that is not a pellet or sweet feed (so textured food), 10% protein and no more than 4% fat. I cannot find anything that meets this criteria except a food made by Seminole Grain, but they don't seem to sell north of North Carolina. I would consider straight hulled oats with a vitamin supplement provided someone can tell me they own a horse that is "hot" and the oats don't make him worse.

I feel like I'm on some weird treasure hunt so if anyone has any idea that would be great. It needs to be sold in Mass., or possibly Canada (only because a lot of feed stores here get hay from Canada, so they might be willing to add a new grain if the truck is coming anyways.

Thanks in advance for your help.

seerfarm · 01-30-2008, 05:56 PM

Found this....

http://www.nutrenaworld.com/Screens/...?ProductID=157

My big guy tends to be on the hot side, and I feed whole oats with no issues as the bulk of his diet.

cameo05 · 01-30-2008, 06:18 PM

Mine are fed 1c allgrain, 2c spur and 2scoops oats per feeding, and mine are not hot at all. I have always fed oats.

MVeventer · 01-30-2008, 06:20 PM

Seerfarm...

Brilliant! I will call the Agway tomorrow to see if they will send me an ingredient list. (As an aside, would it kill grain dealers to put that on their website?

)

Tell me more about feeding oats. I have a TB cross that I do not wish to add "hot" calories to, and my old school understanding of oats is that they are a "hot" food. Have you had your horse on both a grain and oats (at different times) and seen any difference? Do you feed an additional vitamin supplement to balance the oats?

Thanks

cameo05 · 01-30-2008, 06:20 PM

That Triumph is the allgrain that I feed. I have a friend who has Dash for Cash and On the Money Red bred horses and he feeds the same thing I do. None of his are hot from the feed.

MVeventer · 01-30-2008, 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cameo05

That Triumph is the allgrain that I feed. I have a friend who has Dash for Cash and On the Money Red bred horses and he feeds the same thing I do. None of his are hot from the feed.

Does it have molasses in it?

cameo05 · 01-30-2008, 06:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MVeventer

Does it have molasses in it?

I do believe that it has a little molasses. That is why it is not feed in scoops. It is fed in cups. Now oats do have a lot of protien in them, but I have never had it make one difference in my horses. I had a quarter/thorobred cross that I feed her straight oats, then later added superhorse 14 to it, she was only hot when we run her on barrels. This horse was one I would put a child on in a heartbeat.

My vet has gone over the feed with me and he said I had a great mix. If you want to look at my horses, they are on meet the horses under meet my chowhounds. I think it would be page 2 or 3.

Tango · 01-30-2008, 06:50 PM

I feed a 10% all grain by nutrenia. I like it and my horses are not hot. I added oats one time made 2 of them hot. One was hot by nature anyway just made it worse. I do not remember the fat count though.

MVeventer · 01-30-2008, 06:54 PM

Cameo, Your horses are lovely - Tango, that is what I'm worried about is if it will make him edgy. The fat in oats is not real high, although I've forgotten what it is. I really like the idea of the Nutrena.... I'm not too excited about feeding Molasses though. ACK! so many decisions..

cameo05 · 01-30-2008, 07:07 PM

The thing is like the way I feed is it is 1 cup. Just like you would add one cup of flour to something. I am not really crazy about molassis either.

seerfarm · 01-30-2008, 07:20 PM

I have provided another link in regards to oats. I do not totally agree with it, as I have found in my big guy it doesn't make him a lunatic like most other feeds. Sweet feed and molasses make him a pshycotic maniac. I feed him a half scoop whole triple clean oats, 1/2 cup Equine Adult (complete feed pellet), 1 cup wheat bran and a vitamin biotin crumble with a 1/2 teaspoon of probiotics twice a day. Now, he gets that rather he is working or not and there is no difference in attitude or ability and energy, so take that for what it is worth. But, I find it really needs to be a horse by horse evaluation as they are as different as we are.

http://horsecare.stablemade.com/articles2/oats.htm

cameo05 · 01-30-2008, 07:27 PM

You are right seerfarm. Each horse is different. It is trail and error to find the right combination for each horse. I feed that, but my 30yo gets senior feed, and had a horse that I bordered that was on a light balance cause she was a walking sausage with legs.

MVeventer · 01-30-2008, 07:31 PM

Seerfarm,

I have read that very article which is what has concerned me about switching to oats, but I may give it try. I would feed the hull-less I think as I can't soak them before feeding. (He lives at a co-op farm so different people feed all the time, and we have no hot water....). I really wish there was better science behind all this...

Ferronsgranny · 01-30-2008, 07:33 PM

When I went to my inservice on mare care and foaling, the vet said protein did not make a horse hot, it was the binder(usually molasses and other starches) that make them "hot". Vitality is made with veg. oil and is low in starch.

I also found out that my pregnant mare needed to be on a 16% feed to help the development of the foal with good bone and muscles.

The vet that talked to us was Dr. Peter Ryan, Head of the Equine Breeding Program at Mississippi State University.

I also found out that Nutrena and Purina and most other feeds are owed by the same parent company. Cargill.

seerfarm · 01-30-2008, 07:40 PM

There is, it is called trial and error!

I might would suggest using the steamed crimped oats, and I like Central States if you can get them, as they are cleaned and do not have the dust and debrie in them. Please let us know how this turns out, I would be interested in knowing.

By the way, how is your guy breed? Is he Thoroughbred, Appendix etc.
I do alot of feeding research and would like to take notes, if that is OK?

Ferronsgranny · 01-30-2008, 07:40 PM

Here is Vitality Ultra 12%
http://www.nutrenaworld.com/Screens/...?ProductID=174
Vitality Pefrorm 10%

http://www.nutrenaworld.com/Screens/...?ProductID=177

MVeventer · 01-30-2008, 07:54 PM

Ferron - The vitality is a little too high in fat at the 10%

Seerfarm - I will keep you posted, its an interesting journey trying to find something that will work without killing him in the process (I wonder how many grain changes a horse can go through in 3 months

) He is a 6 y.o TB/Hanovarian... Ideally he would get no grain, but I don't think I can keep his weight with just hay... He lives out 24/7 with a couple other horses. He has to have enough food in front of him at grain time to give his pasture mate time to eat as he is the dominant horse. The good news is his pasture mate only gets 1/2 quart so if I can get him down to that little and keep his weight it will be great...

MVeventer · 02-08-2008, 08:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by seerfarm

There is, it is called trial and error!

I might would suggest using the steamed crimped oats, and I like Central States if you can get them, as they are cleaned and do not have the dust and debrie in them. Please let us know how this turns out, I would be interested in knowing.

By the way, how is your guy breed? Is he Thoroughbred, Appendix etc.
I do alot of feeding research and would like to take notes, if that is OK?

As you had wanted to know what I decided to do, after much investigation of the feed available to me here (only 2 feed stores so I have to feed what they sell) I am going to try him on Vintage Senior. I am working with my vet who does a lot of Eastern medicine (acupuncture etc) to go along with standard Western medicine, and we'll see what happens. I also started him on Manna Pro Optizyme....

Amrwmblds2 · 02-08-2008, 09:08 AM

I have had pretty good luck with the Vintage Senior. All my guys are on Blue Seal, I have no complaints at all!

seerfarm · 02-08-2008, 09:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MVeventer

As you had wanted to know what I decided to do, after much investigation of the feed available to me here (only 2 feed stores so I have to feed what they sell) I am going to try him on Vintage Senior. I am working with my vet who does a lot of Eastern medicine (acupuncture etc) to go along with standard Western medicine, and we'll see what happens. I also started him on Manna Pro Optizyme....

Great, just keep us updated.

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
Need Suggestions for bit options.	JTabiszco	Training	3	08-13-2007 08:08 PM
Bit Options/Problems	rockingbranch	Training	3	06-06-2007 10:57 AM
Arena Fencing Options	eieio	Boarding / Farm Upkeep & Real Estate	9	05-10-2007 04:22 PM
Anyone want to help assess our boarding options?	Phili20	Boarding / Farm Upkeep & Real Estate	16	03-13-2007 07:37 AM

01-30-2008, 05:46 PM
MVeventer Weanling Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: East Coast Posts: 477	feed options Okay folks, I'm looking for a food that is not a pellet or sweet feed (so textured food), 10% protein and no more than 4% fat. I cannot find anything that meets this criteria except a food made by Seminole Grain, but they don't seem to sell north of North Carolina. I would consider straight hulled oats with a vitamin supplement provided someone can tell me they own a horse that is "hot" and the oats don't make him worse. I feel like I'm on some weird treasure hunt so if anyone has any idea that would be great. It needs to be sold in Mass., or possibly Canada (only because a lot of feed stores here get hay from Canada, so they might be willing to add a new grain if the truck is coming anyways. Thanks in advance for your help.

01-30-2008, 05:56 PM
seerfarm Bombproof Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Out with the Herd! Posts: 9,633	Found this.... http://www.nutrenaworld.com/Screens/...?ProductID=157 My big guy tends to be on the hot side, and I feed whole oats with no issues as the bulk of his diet. __________________ "One must be a god to be able to tell successes from failures without making a mistake".

01-30-2008, 06:18 PM
cameo05 Pasture Pet Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: In my own world Posts: 12,321	Mine are fed 1c allgrain, 2c spur and 2scoops oats per feeding, and mine are not hot at all. I have always fed oats. __________________ Life is a bed of roses, until you meet up with thorns.

01-30-2008, 06:20 PM
MVeventer Weanling Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: East Coast Posts: 477	Seerfarm... Brilliant! I will call the Agway tomorrow to see if they will send me an ingredient list. (As an aside, would it kill grain dealers to put that on their website?) Tell me more about feeding oats. I have a TB cross that I do not wish to add "hot" calories to, and my old school understanding of oats is that they are a "hot" food. Have you had your horse on both a grain and oats (at different times) and seen any difference? Do you feed an additional vitamin supplement to balance the oats? Thanks

01-30-2008, 06:50 PM
Tango Yearling Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Gordon Ga. Posts: 802	I feed a 10% all grain by nutrenia. I like it and my horses are not hot. I added oats one time made 2 of them hot. One was hot by nature anyway just made it worse. I do not remember the fat count though. __________________ Tango might be short but at least I don't have to duck.

01-30-2008, 06:54 PM
MVeventer Weanling Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: East Coast Posts: 477	Cameo, Your horses are lovely - Tango, that is what I'm worried about is if it will make him edgy. The fat in oats is not real high, although I've forgotten what it is. I really like the idea of the Nutrena.... I'm not too excited about feeding Molasses though. ACK! so many decisions..

01-30-2008, 07:07 PM
cameo05 Pasture Pet Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: In my own world Posts: 12,321	The thing is like the way I feed is it is 1 cup. Just like you would add one cup of flour to something. I am not really crazy about molassis either. __________________ Life is a bed of roses, until you meet up with thorns.

01-30-2008, 07:20 PM
seerfarm Bombproof Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Out with the Herd! Posts: 9,633	I have provided another link in regards to oats. I do not totally agree with it, as I have found in my big guy it doesn't make him a lunatic like most other feeds. Sweet feed and molasses make him a pshycotic maniac. I feed him a half scoop whole triple clean oats, 1/2 cup Equine Adult (complete feed pellet), 1 cup wheat bran and a vitamin biotin crumble with a 1/2 teaspoon of probiotics twice a day. Now, he gets that rather he is working or not and there is no difference in attitude or ability and energy, so take that for what it is worth. But, I find it really needs to be a horse by horse evaluation as they are as different as we are. http://horsecare.stablemade.com/articles2/oats.htm __________________ "One must be a god to be able to tell successes from failures without making a mistake".

01-30-2008, 07:27 PM
cameo05 Pasture Pet Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: In my own world Posts: 12,321	You are right seerfarm. Each horse is different. It is trail and error to find the right combination for each horse. I feed that, but my 30yo gets senior feed, and had a horse that I bordered that was on a light balance cause she was a walking sausage with legs. __________________ Life is a bed of roses, until you meet up with thorns.

01-30-2008, 07:31 PM
MVeventer Weanling Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: East Coast Posts: 477	Seerfarm, I have read that very article which is what has concerned me about switching to oats, but I may give it try. I would feed the hull-less I think as I can't soak them before feeding. (He lives at a co-op farm so different people feed all the time, and we have no hot water....). I really wish there was better science behind all this...

01-30-2008, 07:33 PM
Ferronsgranny Started Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Big Creek, MS Posts: 2,333	When I went to my inservice on mare care and foaling, the vet said protein did not make a horse hot, it was the binder(usually molasses and other starches) that make them "hot". Vitality is made with veg. oil and is low in starch. I also found out that my pregnant mare needed to be on a 16% feed to help the development of the foal with good bone and muscles. The vet that talked to us was Dr. Peter Ryan, Head of the Equine Breeding Program at Mississippi State University. I also found out that Nutrena and Purina and most other feeds are owed by the same parent company. Cargill. __________________ Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

01-30-2008, 07:40 PM
seerfarm Bombproof Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Out with the Herd! Posts: 9,633	There is, it is called trial and error! I might would suggest using the steamed crimped oats, and I like Central States if you can get them, as they are cleaned and do not have the dust and debrie in them. Please let us know how this turns out, I would be interested in knowing. By the way, how is your guy breed? Is he Thoroughbred, Appendix etc. I do alot of feeding research and would like to take notes, if that is OK? __________________ "One must be a god to be able to tell successes from failures without making a mistake".

01-30-2008, 07:54 PM
MVeventer Weanling Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: East Coast Posts: 477	Ferron - The vitality is a little too high in fat at the 10% Seerfarm - I will keep you posted, its an interesting journey trying to find something that will work without killing him in the process (I wonder how many grain changes a horse can go through in 3 months) He is a 6 y.o TB/Hanovarian... Ideally he would get no grain, but I don't think I can keep his weight with just hay... He lives out 24/7 with a couple other horses. He has to have enough food in front of him at grain time to give his pasture mate time to eat as he is the dominant horse. The good news is his pasture mate only gets 1/2 quart so if I can get him down to that little and keep his weight it will be great...

02-08-2008, 09:08 AM
Amrwmblds2 Coming two Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 1,514	I have had pretty good luck with the Vintage Senior. All my guys are on Blue Seal, I have no complaints at all! __________________ www.NewEnglandWarmbloods.com Breeding and Training Quality Sporthorses