To Give West Nile Or Not To GIve?

[luvnhrses]

yes, you can give it before they are bred.....

karen

[luvnhrses]

Try going to the Lost Foal site (you can seach under lost foal, not sure of the exact site) they have pics of what some of the side effects of wn on pregnant mares.....It may be old info but doesn't hurt to check it out...

karen

[ToveroMom]

Sorry but having read almost all the site when it first started and on for a few mos.
Those are opinions and theories from folks suffering losses and being unbelievably in pain at the time.
It is not substantiated-not are the cases confirmed by necropsies and such
Bad things happen at all times.
It is so easy to think or attribute it to one thing when that may not be the case.
I particularly remember one southern gentleman that attributed it to the vaccine and then responded that he never gives shots. OK the number one leading cause of abortion in breeding mares is what?? See my point?
I do not like totally one sided sites. I prefer a more well rounded discussion-like we are having right here-right now
We have had the loss of several foals this year just on this site. I bet the reasons for them are as varied as you will find.
Bad things sometimes just happen. Mother nature can be cruel.

[Touche]

In my opinion, having read current magazines and such I would vaccinate a mare before she was bred. I think we tossed this around before and it really made me think. Everyone has different experiences and bring up great points.
Some losses and defects also could have been caused by toxic chemicals sprayed to reduce to mosquito population. Food for though there.

Definately ask your vet what his/her recommendations are.

[BarrelGirl]

I guess we never though twice about giving WNV. All 15 of our horses got it, and none have adversely reacted thus far.

While I cannot comment about the foaling complications of west nile personally, I just wanted to add that my grandparents had a type of weed in their pasture that made three of their mares abort and one absorb their foal, all in the same year! They didn't vaccinate for west nile, so these losses weren't from that vaccine. It was from a weed, and I found the same type of weed in our pasture. While I love learning more about the equine world, I like to dig into both sides to decide for myself what I will believe.

Isn't it suggested for most shots (besides obviously pneumabort k) to give them before the mare is bred?

[ToveroMom]

Yes and Pnuemabort should be given at 5.7.9 mos.
Tetanus antitoxin to mare and foal on delivery.

[JSlow]

Barrelgirl - sounds like you're talking about fescue in the pastures. It is a type of grass/hay whose endospores cause problems in pregnant mares, including causing them to abort.

[Range]

I give all my vaccinations to my pregnant mares 4 to 6 weeks out from foaling to carry immunity to the foal. Now, I've done it this year, too, and we'll see if we get a live foal. However, it's exactly what my vet recommends and to this point, I've not had a problem. I think each vet has differing opinions and each person has differing opinions, so.....

[KJUN]

I fully vaccinate my mare always follow instructions to the T. I dont skip out on anything and like others have said it is your decision to do what you feel is right. My mare started out on west nile vacs even though there was no problems of it where we lived. She got her first shot then was redone 3 weeks later. I think everyone believes in giving their animals the proper care no matter what. IMO I will not vaccinate during pregnancy for West Nile, Now before and when it is safe after ok but according to my vet she says not during. She has the liscense of being a vet and she knows what she is doing and talking about. IMO to each his own everyone is intitled to their own opinion and if you do you do and if you dont you dont I really do not see what all the fuss is about. Each state is different a with each person. Where I come from they do not do the coggins test on a regular basis unless you plan to travel with your horses, BUT i get coggins every year for my mare. Does this make me wrong?????

[ToveroMom]

Hey-calm down no one said anyone was wrong.
It is just a choice..we make plenty of them for our horses everyday.

[eieio]

No, no one is wrong here. Everyone has an opinion. If the you are going to vaccinate for West Nile it is preferable to vaccinate before breeding. (This from From Dr. Tuttle of Fort Dodge)Remember it does not guarantee your mare will not get WN but it does help the chances significantly she will not. In my case with the number of horses I own, I chose not to. I also inform the future owners of my horses that if they make the choice to give the vaccine, that they will have to start with the two doses 21 days apart. Also it has been proven that horses who are supplemented with St John's Wort and Echinicea can have side effects. It is also not preferable to give this a horse with a compromised immune system. WN is still fairly new and it is still being tested and improved. In a few more years we will all know much more about the WN Innovator. It will become either an old stanby or a "safe to use if..." vaccine, in the same way Moxidectin is a "safe to use if..."

Time will tell!

[southernbellechic]

I have been keeping up with this thread and I am shocked at all the vets that differ on this shot. My vet came out to pull coggins and give us health certs a couple of weeks ago. While he was here he gave the west nile shot to ALL of our horses including my preg mare (due May 06). And yes I told him that she is getting close to her due month. I think I might call around to other vets in this area and see what method they practice with this shot. I do live in MS and we have plenty of mosquitos so I'm not sure. Hope there are no complications with the foal next month!

[sunny]

Southernbellchic, dont worry, I have always had my vet give WN to my mares in foal, twice a year. My one mare that just had her beautiful colt, was given the WN, 4 weeks before she was bred, and again at 6 months and again in March of this year 4 weeks before her due date.
No problems.

[southernbellechic]

thanks Sunny, this is my first foal so that makes me feel better. I can feel the foal moving when I rub on her belly so here's to her having a healthy happy foal next month

[snickers]

Sunny, Southernbellechic,
Did you click on the link that Arab lady posted?
In the link:
While neither of the licensed vaccines is labeled for administrations to pregnant mares at this time, it is recommended that mares be ideally vaccinated before breeding when possible.

Its best to give before breeding and after foaling.

I have had Vets tell me yes and no, and as with anything, IMO, and experience, vaccinate before breeding and after.

I would not fee right telling someone it is safe to do so, when they clearly state it is not labeled for pregnant mares, and something happened.

If she had her shots before breeding, she is fine until after she foals.
I did both, and had trouble with foaling, and problems with foals.

JMO and suggestion. I would not want it on me if I said it was safe, when the label says other wise, and something happend to the foal.

Take everyone's opinions, and you decide yourself.
As it seems, at this time, more do not give the shot.

[southernbellechic]

Snickers-I did read up on it after this thread was started. But that was AFTER my vet said "yes" that she needed the shot even if she's in foal. IMO I'm not letting him give her another WN shot while she is preg. I'll let him come over before and after as I don't want any problems with the foal.

I understand were Sunny was coming from as that was her experience with her horses and situation. Not all situations are the same and I know that something could still happen to my foal since the vet did give her the shot.

[snickers]

SBC,

I have been told by my Vet it was safe to. But I think Vets are given the information that it is safe, but on the label, it doesnt say it is.

My mare had 2 healthy foals before the vaccine came out.
She was given the shot, and foaled a month early, and the foal had leg problems.

Could it of been the shot? Cant say 100%, but no problems prior.
Could it be some horses react to it? Could be.

One woman I know gave her heavy in foal mare the shot. 2 months later, she aborted, a foal with its tendons out the bottom of its feet.
Its eyes were deformed.

I could go on, but I wont.

I pray those that have not had problems, never do.
But when my foal was born with the legs he had, I was totally freaked.
Never had problems with foals.

As always, its what everyone feels they want to do, feel safe doing.
Everyone has only expressed their experiences and opinions.

I just wanted to point out that they recommend the pregnant mares have their shots before breeding and after foaling.

Good luck to everyone.

[Orchid]

Originally Posted by snickers

One woman I know gave her heavy in foal mare the shot. 2 months later, she aborted, a foal with its tendons out the bottom of its feet.
Its eyes were deformed.

snickers, I am curious - at what stage of the foal's development was the vaccine given? Most structures are formed early in development and a vaccine given later on would not affect them....

[snickers]

Orchid,
she was in her eighth month given the shot, and 2 months later, right before due date, aborted.

She called me called me crying and so very upset.
She felt herself that is was the shot.
I cant say yea or nay on it, just weird that would happen and the other cases I have been told and expereinced after the shot.

Its one of those things you just wonder.

[kimball1]

Most insurance companies REQUIRE your horse is vaccinated for West Nile and it voids your coverage if you don't so if your horses are insured check your policies.