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Old 05-23-2009, 10:06 PM  
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Weak in hindend? - Finally got some pictures!

I have a horse that some people want me to take and train for them. She is 7 y/o grade QH mare. Very athletic looking and seems to be easily trained. She thinks like and arab so knocks heads with some people when they try to force her to do things. The people who own her bought her on the assumption that she is a beginner riding horse. Turns out she is definately not for a beginner, takes advantage and just becomes generally difficult. As soon as you set some rules, boundries and limitations she is more than happy to comply! Problem is she seems very weak in the hind end, was like that when they got her but I don't think they noticed that when they got her. She can walk, trot fine (looks a little like a dysplastic dog sometimes) once her hind leg starts to trip she cannot get it under her again until she slows down. When she lopes, her back legs are about a 1 -1 1/2 feet apart when viewed from the back. Her back toes are very long (can't seem to get the farrier to shorten them at all, he says that is the way her foot dictates to trim) so her foot seems to sit very far underneith herself all the time. When you back her up she seems physically impossible to actually lift her feet and place them she just drags them backward. When she spooks in the pasture and tries to do a roll back and then run she has fallen down and ended up sitting like a dog. I will try and get some pictures sent tomorrow so you can see her but until then any ideas what could be wrong? They had one vet out the took a quick look and said she was fine but I don't think she is. Could it be possible that she had West Nile or something but recovered with residual effects, I can't seem to find much info on this but perhaps I am not searching with the right terms!
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Old 05-24-2009, 05:46 AM  
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Anyway to get a video...all kinds of thing pop into my mind when you are talking about this sort of weakness.

Also some still shots ..front, sides and particularly hind legs from the stifles/hip down.
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Old 05-24-2009, 06:59 AM  
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Has she been seen by a vet? She sounds very dangerous to be around right now. Is EPM in Canada?
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Old 05-24-2009, 08:13 AM  
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I veterinary exam would definitely be the place to start as it's possible that there is a neurological problem that can make this horse not only a danger to herself but a danger to anyone riding her.
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Old 05-24-2009, 08:53 AM  
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I agree about the vet exam. That could be a number of things. I'd certainly not want to be on her when she has an incident. Poor mare, it must be scary for her, too.
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Old 05-24-2009, 10:47 AM  
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They did have the vet out for something else (I can't remember what) back when they first got her (about a year ago) and he told them she was fine so they didn't pursue it further. I have ridden her once just walking and she isn't worse or better with a rider. She doesn't seem to hurt or anything. Her sypmtoms haven't gotten any worse or better in the year we have seen her. She stands for the farrier no problem. Where she came from they said they always rode her on trails w/t/l without any problems. She doesn't just fall down randomly it is always with the same type of movement whether she does it herself or you ask her to do it. My sister is going to take pictures today hopefully and send them and I can post them! I have no idea how to get a video here- maybe someone can send me some instructions!
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Old 05-24-2009, 11:14 AM  
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They did have the vet out for something else (I can't remember what) back when they first got her (about a year ago) and he told them she was fine so they didn't pursue it further. I have ridden her once just walking and she isn't worse or better with a rider. She doesn't seem to hurt or anything. Her sypmtoms haven't gotten any worse or better in the year we have seen her. She stands for the farrier no problem. Where she came from they said they always rode her on trails w/t/l without any problems. She doesn't just fall down randomly it is always with the same type of movement whether she does it herself or you ask her to do it. My sister is going to take pictures today hopefully and send them and I can post them! I have no idea how to get a video here- maybe someone can send me some instructions!
Anytime you have a horse that is falling down randomly, it is time to call the vet.....the fact that it has been let go for a year concerns me.....just because one vet was not concerned doesn;t mean a thing, common sense should tell you this is not right, get another one that will look at the horse. It sounds like a neurological problem, and those almost always get worse with time left untreated........Call a vet and do the horse a favor, skip the video.
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Old 05-24-2009, 11:20 AM  
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Anytime you have a horse that is falling down randomly, it is time to call the vet......
I can't call the vet as it isn't my horse yet and I stated just above that she doesn't fall down randomly it is with the same specific movement everytime.

It is almost like she has a pinched nerve and when she goes into a specific range of motion her muscles fail. She never crashes to the ground it seems to be controlled. She doesn't always go down either but just looks like she is struggling a bit with balance.
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Old 05-24-2009, 11:49 AM  
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I can't call the vet as it isn't my horse yet and I stated just above that she doesn't fall down randomly it is with the same specific movement everytime.

It is almost like she has a pinched nerve and when she goes into a specific range of motion her muscles fail. She never crashes to the ground it seems to be controlled. She doesn't always go down either but just looks like she is struggling a bit with balance.

Ok, like I said, anytime a horse falls dowm, or "loses their balance" on aregular basis, it is time to call the vet.......That is what I would then recommend to the owner, not training and riding.
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Old 05-24-2009, 01:18 PM  
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I had a colt that did the same exact thing you're describing. He was diagnosed as a wobbler. His was caused though rather than being born with it. He had a bad reaction to anesthesia while being gelded and/or smacked his poll very hard on the side of the stall when waking up.

I ended up giving him away as a companion for colts/weanlings.
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Old 05-24-2009, 02:41 PM  
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Yep, have to agree with the rest hearing all the story now. New Vet check ASAP!

I wouldn't take a horse for training, or train if there were even the slightest issue performing any gaits. Obviously something isn't right, and the concern to cause greater damage beyond the inital area would be my concern.

I am shocked to hear that a Vet didn't think it was an issue that this horse was weak to the point of going down/stumbling with or without a rider.
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Old 05-24-2009, 02:59 PM  
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They have wanted me to take this horse since christmas but I am so leary because of this issue hence the reason she isn't here yet! These people are very inexperienced with horses and it is tough getting through to them that this IS something that needs further investigation. My hope by coming here and asking you guys was to get some knew ideas of what could be wrong so that I could present it to them and hopefully they would act further on this. Basically I just need someone to back up what I am saying LOL!
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Old 05-24-2009, 03:05 PM  
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May try then, gathering as much printable info on hindend weakness, stumbling, possible diseases and or conditions, etc. that you can find and present them.

If you have a Vet you trust and will talk with you, then maybe present the question to him/her and see what there thoughts are and what they would or would not be possible looking for in the diagnosis.
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Old 05-25-2009, 09:47 PM  
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Take the horse for training once they have a soundness exam? That way you can book them and get them to Vet the horse first. This horse could fall with you on be carefull.
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Old 05-25-2009, 10:42 PM  
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This is what I am attempting to do. I have told them from the first time they asked if I would take her that she would have to be vetted first. I want her to go the the university so she gets a thorough workup by horse competent vets!

I am still waiting for the pictures to be sent to me and I will post them asap!!!
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Old 05-27-2009, 08:08 AM  
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May be totally irrelevant but I remembered reading this article and it was enough to make me stop feeding beet pulp, which I was never fond of anyway:


http://ezinearticles.com/?Is-Beet-Pu...tory&id=759474
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Old 05-27-2009, 10:09 AM  
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May be totally irrelevant but I remembered reading this article and it was enough to make me stop feeding beet pulp, which I was never fond of anyway:


http://ezinearticles.com/?Is-Beet-Pu...tory&id=759474
OMG! That sounds just like my mare! She is very weak in the hind end (more so each and every day, it seems). I have had her on beet pulp for well over a year due to issues maintaining weight, etc. The thought that I could be making her problems worse really makes me ill. Has anyone had reverse results when removing beet pulp?
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Old 05-27-2009, 10:29 AM  
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OMG! That sounds just like my mare! She is very weak in the hind end (more so each and every day, it seems). I have had her on beet pulp for well over a year due to issues maintaining weight, etc. The thought that I could be making her problems worse really makes me ill. Has anyone had reverse results when removing beet pulp?
I quit feeding beet pulp after I read that article but I never fed much to begin with and didn't have any weakness issue come up in that short time. I had one filly that had loose stools from the timothy/alfalfa hay I was feeding and my vet recommended adding some beet pulp shreds to her feed which did help, but seemed kind of backwards to me. I got some timothy/orchardgrass hay just for her and dropped the beet pulp.

I won't use it to bulk up a horse either since it's a false weight gain and is mostly water weight. I know some people who show cattle and use it mainly for the water weight gain to bulk up their show cattle. Of course the digestive systems are totally different.

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Old 05-27-2009, 11:03 AM  
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I quit feeding beet pulp after I read that article but I never fed much to begin with and didn't have any weakness issue come up in that short time. I had one filly that had loose stools from the timothy/alfalfa hay I was feeding and my vet recommended adding some beet pulp shreds to her feed which did help, but seemed kind of backwards to me. I got some timothy/orchardgrass hay just for her and dropped the beet pulp.

I won't use it to bulk up a horse either since it's a false weight gain and is mostly water weight. I know some people who show cattle and use it mainly for the water weight gain to bulk up their show cattle.
I was told my mare had a stifle injury before I bought her but she was okay to ride. She has since developed ringbone (which I believe has fused so she should be okay to ride). I have noticed her hind end seem to "go out from under her" sometimes and this article has me wondering if I have made her worse by feeding her beet pulp. It looks as though the only thing to do would be to cut it out, add free choice trace minerals to the diets, and see what the results would be. I honestly wish I had read that before now. I just this week have been considering giving her away as a companion horse. The thought broke my heart as she's the sweetest, calmest mare ever. I haven't followed through and will try a change in diet before a change in location for her! One can only hope for good results!
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Last edited by 3horses : 05-27-2009 at 11:04 AM. Reason: To the OP: didn't mean to hijack your thread...sorry!
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Old 05-27-2009, 11:38 AM  
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I was told my mare had a stifle injury before I bought her but she was okay to ride. She has since developed ringbone (which I believe has fused so she should be okay to ride). I have noticed her hind end seem to "go out from under her" sometimes and this article has me wondering if I have made her worse by feeding her beet pulp. It looks as though the only thing to do would be to cut it out, add free choice trace minerals to the diets, and see what the results would be. I honestly wish I had read that before now. I just this week have been considering giving her away as a companion horse. The thought broke my heart as she's the sweetest, calmest mare ever. I haven't followed through and will try a change in diet before a change in location for her! One can only hope for good results!
3 horses: My vet loves beet pulp! He swears by it for everything from putting weight on a horse to cleaning sand from their bellies. I have fed it for quite some time with no adverse affects. However, I will say that if you search the web you can find good and bad on everything we feed our horses. Ranging from alfalfa to grains and yes beet pulp. I would consult your vet in regards to her backend. A horses backend giving out on them can be caused by numerous factors! Have you that about having a chiro adjust her? I know my Aunt's geldings backend goes out from him and he's not on beet pulp at all. Anyways, I guess my two cents.... for what it's worth is that there are good and bad studies on all feed. I would research several articles and more importantly consult your vet who knows your horse! Best of luck!
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