question...

royaldakotabreez · 08-26-2008, 09:44 PM

ok, i have a question....
i buy a horse, lady says "for an experienced rider", and i tell her i ride all the time (a lie) and she agrees to sell the horse to me. The horse performed perfectly for the chick i bought him from, and i rode him and loved him, but didn't get a vet check or anything done....
and i get the horse home and it freaks out and i can't ride it and it has a rearing problem....and i send it to a trainer and the trainer says the horse is demented, and the vet says he has issues up the @&#&@*
is it right to sue the owner for "drugging" the horse without a vet check to prove it?

barnbum2106 · 08-26-2008, 09:47 PM

I would say no. Was there a VERY descriptive bill of sale?

royaldakotabreez · 08-26-2008, 09:49 PM

i don't believe there was a bill of sale at all...

Freedomnchrist · 08-26-2008, 09:49 PM

My...that sounds complicated.

bitgirl_95 · 08-26-2008, 09:52 PM

imo its kinda your fault for not getting a vet check but then again she sounds like a shady lady

royaldakotabreez · 08-26-2008, 09:53 PM

i haven't bought a horse, but i know someone who did....she didn't get a vet check or anything done and the horse was AWESOME for the girl, and was really calm when they were riding him, but when they got him back after a couple days he started rearing and bolting....just tons of problems, and she sent him to a prof trainer for 30 days but he came back and the guy said he was demented....and she had a vet check him out and the vet said he's got some issues...all of them mental....

snwflk · 08-26-2008, 09:53 PM

I hate to say it , but YOu are out of luck- I dont want to sound harsh- but even I ( I have leased before , but never owned one of my own yet) know that I need a vet Check on EVERY horse that I intend to purchase- Not to say that from some-one I trusted , I could go with out. But mainly to be made aware of anything that I would need to know to make sure I gave the best care possible to my new horse- so NO you cant sue. In a court of law, you'd be laughed right out of there especially with no contract and no vet check- Best friend is a lawyer- sorry

I am so sorry that you were "taken" with a bad horse- maybe it will get better? Or maybe you might be able to trade or give it to a trainer in exchange for something else-

Sorry-

royaldakotabreez · 08-26-2008, 09:54 PM

so now the girl i know's uncle is telling her to sue the lady for lieing and possibly drugging the horse...but they have no proof that this is what was done...

thumpersgirl · 08-26-2008, 10:03 PM

I would say no. First off, she misled the seller by saying she was experienced (and the seller said for experienced rider only which is a red flag right there). Second, the claim of drugging is only a guess. There is no proof. Without a vet record, there is no way to prove it. My guess is it would never make it to court. Slippery slope. If they are saying bad things about the seller without proof of it, she could come right back at them with a lawsuit of her own.

GreyDot · 08-26-2008, 10:03 PM

Sounds very involved. While I'm sorry for the buyer, I'd also say that the seller saying "Experienced rider only", and the buyer LYING about riding experience pretty much clarifies everything.

The horse probably went nicely for the seller because it knew it can't get away with crap with the seller. It also had not had the time to figure out how to get away with murder when the buyer rode it. But when the buyer got it home, the horse simply said "AHA! Gotcha! Now, there's no-one here that I respect, that will tell me not to pull crap." And the horse did what it wanted to do all along.

Good reason to never, ever, EVER lie about your riding experience - especially when buying a horse - and to listen to the vendor when they try to warn about the horse being more suitable for someone who knows what they're doing. All I can say is that the buyer should have been honest. The seller obviously was.

I'm backing Thumpersgirl on this - it's not a good idea to blame the seller, especially when she tried to warn the buyer. It could bounce back very unpleasantly.

pippy · 08-26-2008, 10:05 PM

No, I don't think you'd have a chance, unless there was a contract stating there were NO problems what so ever and a vet certificate from her vet...then it would be your vet's word against hers..

royaldakotabreez · 08-26-2008, 10:10 PM

thanks guys....this chick isn't the brightest crayon in the box, and the horse is GORGEOUS! and i was thinking the same thing about the respect thing. the chick that had him before took an apprenticeship class under a big name trainer....(the bf of the girl said John Lyons sounded familiar....? but am not sure if that could be it) but she got bucked off a horse and broke her back, so she can't train anymore, which is why she was selling this horse. she had had him all his life, and she was the only person that ever rode him....which could be another factor?
also, she rode him the day after she brought him home...so he didn't have time to settle in...another factor? then it just spiraled down from there maybe since she didn't correct him the right way right then?

jolene.fargo · 08-26-2008, 10:22 PM

I agree with Greydot!

Buyer lied about riding ability, seller was honest about the horse needing an experienced rider. No vet check done so the buyer has no right to say it was drugged seeing as she isn't experienced enough to know any better.
The horse probably knows that he can now get away with things and maybe he's not good with new places and needs to settle before being ridden by an experienced rider.
There is no grounds to sue, if the buyer tried to sue, the seller could counter sue and my bet is that the Seller would win and could also add in slandering against the buyer for dragging her name through mud.

Let this be a lesson, when someone buys a horse, they should never lie about their riding abilities. The seller probably would not have sold the horse to her had she been honest.

Edited to add: Has this girl spoken with the seller? Maybe the seller could give her some tips, refer her to a good trainer or help her sell her?

NoniMe · 08-26-2008, 10:28 PM

O.K., I'm not sure of the facts...but if a lie is involved, a misrepresentation, it doesn't seem as if the buyer would have a leg to stand on, even if there were drugs involved.

Add to that there was no vet check, no drug testing, and any judge worth their salt is going to say 'leave now, you're wasting my time.' The argument will be made that the horse was sold to an experienced rider, buyer beware, no vet check done...too bad, so sad.

Lying tends to shoot oneself in the foot...

Best-
Noni

EquineAlberta · 08-26-2008, 10:38 PM

Feed change, tack change, change in location, change in rider...all reasons that the horse could change. The only way I can see grounds for legal action is if you have a witness that saw her drug the horse, or a blood test showing the drugs.

Has she tried talking to the seller? If someone bought a horse from me and it went nutso, I would want to know and I would want to help. Jumping to the conclusion she was lied to isnt fair to the seller or the horse.

Karen

royaldakotabreez · 08-26-2008, 10:49 PM

to my knowledge she hasn't spoken to the seller...
thanks guys, i just wanted some opinions on this, i personally think it's a crock, and she should have been honest about her riding abilities...she made herself out to be the greatest rider ever....and the chick even said she would be VERY picky about who this horse goes to since it sounds like they had a strong bond...

GreyDot · 08-26-2008, 10:55 PM

Oh wow... well, then, she should be grateful she did not get hurt. After reading your last post, I feel very sorry for the seller - she wanted her horse to go to a good home, with an experienced rider, but by now the horse probably has re-discovered a couple bad habits, in addition to being faced with a complete stranger who does not know how to deal with his individual issues. If I were the seller, I'd be very, very upset to find out this has happened. This horse was sold as a last measure, the girl obviously would not have sold him otherwise. They had a good thing going, until her injury, and I'm willing to bet that the seller had some moments when she worried about how he was doing. To agree with EquineAlberta, if I were the seller, I'd definitely want to help - but I would also be very put out about having to fix problems that may not have appeared in the first place if the rider knew what she was doing. Very sad - both for the horse and for the seller. I really don't feel sorry for the buyer.

royaldakotabreez · 08-26-2008, 11:01 PM

she did have big plans for the horse the way it sounds, since she put 30 days of barrels on him...and was planning on doing some showing i guess....
the girl that bought him definitely got herself into a mess, and i just hope the horse isn't the one who suffers for her mistake....

**gbarmranch** · 08-27-2008, 05:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EquineAlberta

Feed change, tack change, change in location, change in rider...all reasons that the horse could change. The only way I can see grounds for legal action is if you have a witness that saw her drug the horse, or a blood test showing the drugs.

Has she tried talking to the seller? If someone bought a horse from me and it went nutso, I would want to know and I would want to help. Jumping to the conclusion she was lied to isnt fair to the seller or the horse.

Karen

I agree completely with Karen - it is unfair to make an assumption that the seller lied if she hasn't spoken to her..

No law suit will result from this without proof of being drugged; no vet check, no proof...

She needs to call the seller..

Sunlei · 08-27-2008, 07:01 AM

Couple horses I looked at were so beautiful, they just were not a good fit for me. And the sellers were honest, they told me the horse will be fine while they are there but alone...I am just not a good enough rider. The sellers were honest and I was honest when discussing my level of experience.

I still think about those horses but I sure am happy with my mare. And I'm glad the sellers were honest with me.

Tell her to call the seller and fess up that the horse is to much for her and the horse is unhappy. Good chance the seller will take the horse back, if seller cared about the horses wellbeing.

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08-26-2008, 09:44 PM
royaldakotabreez Yearling Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: S. Dak Posts: 506	question... ok, i have a question.... i buy a horse, lady says "for an experienced rider", and i tell her i ride all the time (a lie) and she agrees to sell the horse to me. The horse performed perfectly for the chick i bought him from, and i rode him and loved him, but didn't get a vet check or anything done.... and i get the horse home and it freaks out and i can't ride it and it has a rearing problem....and i send it to a trainer and the trainer says the horse is demented, and the vet says he has issues up the @&#&@* is it right to sue the owner for "drugging" the horse without a vet check to prove it? __________________ Saving one horse might not change the world, but it will change the world for one horse...

08-26-2008, 09:47 PM
barnbum2106 Weanling Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Pensacola, FL Posts: 261	I would say no. Was there a VERY descriptive bill of sale? __________________ Owned by: Bailey, Bo, Lucy, & Hoosier

08-26-2008, 09:49 PM
royaldakotabreez Yearling Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: S. Dak Posts: 506	i don't believe there was a bill of sale at all... __________________ Saving one horse might not change the world, but it will change the world for one horse...

08-26-2008, 09:49 PM
Freedomnchrist Greenbroke Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Alabama Posts: 3,312	My...that sounds complicated.

08-26-2008, 09:52 PM
bitgirl_95 Weanling Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Kansas Posts: 494	imo its kinda your fault for not getting a vet check but then again she sounds like a shady lady __________________ Merry Christmas!

08-26-2008, 09:53 PM
royaldakotabreez Yearling Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: S. Dak Posts: 506	i haven't bought a horse, but i know someone who did....she didn't get a vet check or anything done and the horse was AWESOME for the girl, and was really calm when they were riding him, but when they got him back after a couple days he started rearing and bolting....just tons of problems, and she sent him to a prof trainer for 30 days but he came back and the guy said he was demented....and she had a vet check him out and the vet said he's got some issues...all of them mental.... __________________ Saving one horse might not change the world, but it will change the world for one horse...

08-26-2008, 09:53 PM
snwflk Yearling Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Colorado Posts: 523	I hate to say it , but YOu are out of luck- I dont want to sound harsh- but even I ( I have leased before , but never owned one of my own yet) know that I need a vet Check on EVERY horse that I intend to purchase- Not to say that from some-one I trusted , I could go with out. But mainly to be made aware of anything that I would need to know to make sure I gave the best care possible to my new horse- so NO you cant sue. In a court of law, you'd be laughed right out of there especially with no contract and no vet check- Best friend is a lawyer- sorry I am so sorry that you were "taken" with a bad horse- maybe it will get better? Or maybe you might be able to trade or give it to a trainer in exchange for something else- Sorry- __________________ Suzie Q

08-26-2008, 09:54 PM
royaldakotabreez Yearling Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: S. Dak Posts: 506	so now the girl i know's uncle is telling her to sue the lady for lieing and possibly drugging the horse...but they have no proof that this is what was done... __________________ Saving one horse might not change the world, but it will change the world for one horse...

08-26-2008, 10:03 PM
thumpersgirl Greenbroke Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 3,380	I would say no. First off, she misled the seller by saying she was experienced (and the seller said for experienced rider only which is a red flag right there). Second, the claim of drugging is only a guess. There is no proof. Without a vet record, there is no way to prove it. My guess is it would never make it to court. Slippery slope. If they are saying bad things about the seller without proof of it, she could come right back at them with a lawsuit of her own. __________________ Some people are like Slinkies; they're good for nothing, but make you smile when you push them down a long flight of stairs.

08-26-2008, 10:03 PM
GreyDot Started Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Between AZ and OH Posts: 2,272	Sounds very involved. While I'm sorry for the buyer, I'd also say that the seller saying "Experienced rider only", and the buyer LYING about riding experience pretty much clarifies everything. The horse probably went nicely for the seller because it knew it can't get away with crap with the seller. It also had not had the time to figure out how to get away with murder when the buyer rode it. But when the buyer got it home, the horse simply said "AHA! Gotcha! Now, there's no-one here that I respect, that will tell me not to pull crap." And the horse did what it wanted to do all along. Good reason to never, ever, EVER lie about your riding experience - especially when buying a horse - and to listen to the vendor when they try to warn about the horse being more suitable for someone who knows what they're doing. All I can say is that the buyer should have been honest. The seller obviously was. I'm backing Thumpersgirl on this - it's not a good idea to blame the seller, especially when she tried to warn the buyer. It could bounce back very unpleasantly. __________________ ...There is nothing to be done till a horse's head is settled. ~William Cavendish Stuipid CAN be fixed... you just have to hit it hard enough! ~A rare moment of inspiration

08-26-2008, 10:05 PM
pippy Long Yearling Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: minnesota Posts: 1,055	No, I don't think you'd have a chance, unless there was a contract stating there were NO problems what so ever and a vet certificate from her vet...then it would be your vet's word against hers.. __________________ Put your heart, mind, intellect, and soul even to your smallest acts. This is the secret of success.\" â€“ Swami Sivananda Saraswati Last edited by pippy : 08-26-2008 at 10:07 PM.

08-26-2008, 10:10 PM
royaldakotabreez Yearling Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: S. Dak Posts: 506	thanks guys....this chick isn't the brightest crayon in the box, and the horse is GORGEOUS! and i was thinking the same thing about the respect thing. the chick that had him before took an apprenticeship class under a big name trainer....(the bf of the girl said John Lyons sounded familiar....? but am not sure if that could be it) but she got bucked off a horse and broke her back, so she can't train anymore, which is why she was selling this horse. she had had him all his life, and she was the only person that ever rode him....which could be another factor? also, she rode him the day after she brought him home...so he didn't have time to settle in...another factor? then it just spiraled down from there maybe since she didn't correct him the right way right then? __________________ Saving one horse might not change the world, but it will change the world for one horse...

08-26-2008, 10:22 PM
jolene.fargo Halter broke Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Kelowna Posts: 190	I agree with Greydot! Buyer lied about riding ability, seller was honest about the horse needing an experienced rider. No vet check done so the buyer has no right to say it was drugged seeing as she isn't experienced enough to know any better. The horse probably knows that he can now get away with things and maybe he's not good with new places and needs to settle before being ridden by an experienced rider. There is no grounds to sue, if the buyer tried to sue, the seller could counter sue and my bet is that the Seller would win and could also add in slandering against the buyer for dragging her name through mud. Let this be a lesson, when someone buys a horse, they should never lie about their riding abilities. The seller probably would not have sold the horse to her had she been honest. Edited to add: Has this girl spoken with the seller? Maybe the seller could give her some tips, refer her to a good trainer or help her sell her? __________________ I'm not confused, I'm well mixed... http://jolenefargo.webs.com - Jolene Fargo with Hyundai Canada Last edited by jolene.fargo : 08-26-2008 at 10:24 PM.

08-26-2008, 10:28 PM
NoniMe Greenbroke Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Southern California Posts: 3,050	O.K., I'm not sure of the facts...but if a lie is involved, a misrepresentation, it doesn't seem as if the buyer would have a leg to stand on, even if there were drugs involved. Add to that there was no vet check, no drug testing, and any judge worth their salt is going to say 'leave now, you're wasting my time.' The argument will be made that the horse was sold to an experienced rider, buyer beware, no vet check done...too bad, so sad. Lying tends to shoot oneself in the foot... Best- Noni __________________ "His name is Tango," said I. The wee boy, in his childish lisp, replied "no, his name is Bongo Mountain."

08-26-2008, 10:38 PM
EquineAlberta Seasoned Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Alberta, Canada Posts: 4,425	Feed change, tack change, change in location, change in rider...all reasons that the horse could change. The only way I can see grounds for legal action is if you have a witness that saw her drug the horse, or a blood test showing the drugs. Has she tried talking to the seller? If someone bought a horse from me and it went nutso, I would want to know and I would want to help. Jumping to the conclusion she was lied to isnt fair to the seller or the horse. Karen __________________ Hillside Stable, Ardrossan, AB Do unto others as you would have them do unto you...is it really that hard?

08-26-2008, 10:49 PM
royaldakotabreez Yearling Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: S. Dak Posts: 506	to my knowledge she hasn't spoken to the seller... thanks guys, i just wanted some opinions on this, i personally think it's a crock, and she should have been honest about her riding abilities...she made herself out to be the greatest rider ever....and the chick even said she would be VERY picky about who this horse goes to since it sounds like they had a strong bond... __________________ Saving one horse might not change the world, but it will change the world for one horse...

08-26-2008, 10:55 PM
GreyDot Started Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Between AZ and OH Posts: 2,272	Oh wow... well, then, she should be grateful she did not get hurt. After reading your last post, I feel very sorry for the seller - she wanted her horse to go to a good home, with an experienced rider, but by now the horse probably has re-discovered a couple bad habits, in addition to being faced with a complete stranger who does not know how to deal with his individual issues. If I were the seller, I'd be very, very upset to find out this has happened. This horse was sold as a last measure, the girl obviously would not have sold him otherwise. They had a good thing going, until her injury, and I'm willing to bet that the seller had some moments when she worried about how he was doing. To agree with EquineAlberta, if I were the seller, I'd definitely want to help - but I would also be very put out about having to fix problems that may not have appeared in the first place if the rider knew what she was doing. Very sad - both for the horse and for the seller. I really don't feel sorry for the buyer. __________________ ...There is nothing to be done till a horse's head is settled. ~William Cavendish Stuipid CAN be fixed... you just have to hit it hard enough! ~A rare moment of inspiration

08-26-2008, 11:01 PM
royaldakotabreez Yearling Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: S. Dak Posts: 506	she did have big plans for the horse the way it sounds, since she put 30 days of barrels on him...and was planning on doing some showing i guess.... the girl that bought him definitely got herself into a mess, and i just hope the horse isn't the one who suffers for her mistake.... __________________ Saving one horse might not change the world, but it will change the world for one horse...

08-27-2008, 07:01 AM
Sunlei Yearling Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Texas Posts: 950	Couple horses I looked at were so beautiful, they just were not a good fit for me. And the sellers were honest, they told me the horse will be fine while they are there but alone...I am just not a good enough rider. The sellers were honest and I was honest when discussing my level of experience. I still think about those horses but I sure am happy with my mare. And I'm glad the sellers were honest with me. Tell her to call the seller and fess up that the horse is to much for her and the horse is unhappy. Good chance the seller will take the horse back, if seller cared about the horses wellbeing.