Great Pyrenees puppy advice please!

[Sonseeahray's_girl]

Wow, it's been a while since I posted on here!
Anyways, we're looking at getting a Great Pyr for our farm, and we currently have two options for breeders in our area, but I'm not sure which one to go with...opinions please!

#1-Puppies will be born in September, ready in ten weeks after that (coming home sometime near middle to end of November). Breeder doesn't breed more than once per year, has a farm to expose pups to other animals (for guarding training), charges $550-$800 per puppy depending on sex/markings, etc. Female is 130lbs approx. , Male is about the same.

#2-Puppies ready in two weeks. She lets them go at 6-8 weeks, this particular litter has been bottle fed since birth since the mother got mastitis. She also has a full working farm, and kids. This mother is only 90 lbs, father is 120lbs...she said they aren't the biggest Pyr's you'll see, but conformationally correct. She charges $500/puppy. I don't know how many litters per year she has.

We need a good guardian dog that will be able to hold his own against the coyotes/wolves, etc that we get out here. Our winters are long and cold (December to April, with temps going as low as -30), so I'm worried about a late fall puppy. He will not be coming in the house, strictly living in the barn for shelter.

Okay, hit me with your thoughts!

[breburtch]

I think breeder #1 sounds like the best option and heres my reasons why:
She keeps the puppies till there 10weeks so the puppy will be more mature and should be fully weaned where breeder #2 sends them at the average age but they have also been hand raised so they will most likely be more clingy and wanting to be with people rather then doing there job.

Breeder #1 puppies will be much larger then the ones from breeder #2 which gives #1's puppies a bigger advantage for gaurding the property.

Breeder #1 also sounds very responsible breeding only once a year and exposing the puppies to everything.

Now are either breeders dogs raised outside? or are they all inside.

My only concern is your planning on leaving the puppy outside 24/7, do you have another dog that it will be with 24/7. Until the puppy has learn the property boundries and has been taught all it's comands etc I'd be a little worried about it being left out alone for long periods or time at such a young age.


Research as much as you can about both breeders and see if you can find owners of puppies bought from both breeders and see what those puppies have turned out like and what there jobs are etc.

Also make sure they come with first shots etc and a health check as with alot of large breed dogs they can have hip problems etc

[Sonseeahray's_girl]

I believe they're both raising their pups outside/in the barn.

No we don't have any other dogs. I only work part-time, so the pup wouldn't be alone all the time, but maybe that's something we need to plan more for. He could stay in the barn on my work days.

We plan on getting those electric collar dog containment units, and a few expansions so that it can wander over a few acres, but no farther, until he learns his boundaries.

Both breeders get the puppies vet-checked, wormed and vaccinated before placing them.

[snwflk]

I have a Pyr, and you CANNOT leave a puppy alone UNATTENEDED in a barn - that could be a very dangerous situation!~- I would suggest- a crate just until its bigger say around 6 months then it can be free when you are gone- they are INCREDIBLE gaurd dogs- so you dont have to worry there - but I will tell you a LONELY PUPPY will HOWL ALL DAY LONG!! and eat something they shouldnt- but they are great dogs- as long as it has a bed of deep straw in the barn during the winter, it will grow a coat that is very thick and should be fine- They are bred to be w/ the sheep in the alps- so that is also a 24/7 type job- so it should be fine// But I too would go with the older dog- it will be more ready to work for you and it will be more mentally mature- the smaller one will be very needy-

Good luck and of course we need pics of the the adorable ball of fur!!

[alliebath]

On just this little bit of info, I guess I like the sounds of litter 1 -but my determining factor would be do any of the parents of either litter have OFA clearances? Pyr's of course, like most large breeds, have ortho problems - hip and elbow dysplasia. Another thought is that bigger is not always better in terms of long term health effects. The big dogs present an imposing presence, but the smaller dogs may be very quick on their feet.

Either litter, keep the puppy lean - not skinny, but lean. I know many giant breed breeders who NEVER feed puppy food. They start thier puppies on a high quality adult food - to slow down their growth, to keep them lean.

I am hoping that one or both of these breeders are doing the mininum health clearances (and can show you the OFA form - or you can research it by the dogs name on www.offa.org) at these prices.

[KateG]

I would be very concerned about expecting a puppy to guard your property from coyotes etc. I don't know about Pyrennese, but with Rotties it takes 3-5 years for them to mature enough to know their business and be an effective guardian. Before that, they're just big goofs ... actually, they always are...but they do get a serious side with maturity. #1 sounds like a better bet, since her puppies will have more time for their mother to teach them how to be farm dogs. You might think about getting two dogs, one a puppy and one mature one that can begin work immediately and teach the puppy how to get on. Your breeder might be able to put you in touch with a dog, perhaps one of hers, that needs a new family/job.

[Sonseeahray's_girl]

Thanks for the suggestions all, keep them coming! The more info and insight I can get the better.

We don't expect the 10 week old to guard, but they reach 100lbs by 5-6 months, so he'll be a good enough size to intimidate any unwanted visitors pretty quickly.

I too am leaning towards the older puppy...just a feeling I got from talking to both breeders, but of course I'll have to go and see both farms in person.

[Slim Pikkens]

Run a jenny with your animals. They are ferocious little fighters. Many keep two and they are not expensive to feed.

[James3-08]

<Snip. Please read the forum rules regarding solicitations.>

[Karen Cole]

I agree if you are going with a pup #1 for all the reasons stated BUT I also think you would be far better off getting an adult dog that has been working. Wait until the adult is settled in then get a pup you should never expect a LGD to protect a herd of anything by it'self. Often times one dog will go after the offender and the other will round the herd up and take it to saftey.

Of the LGD breeds Pyrs do tend to roam and they do bark the most which is something you will need to consider. I've heard of alot of complaints just because the neighbor with cows was upset that he had to fend off a dog guarding his new calf....or herd. Where there is a will there is a way and Pyrs will guard what ever they feel is thiers to guard.

There are several goat lists on yahoo that weekly have goat herd dispersals once the goats are gone they will often give the LGDs away just so they have a job to do. Sometimes you have to live trap them as many of the dogs are not handled at all...they need to be self sufficant if they are guarding on thousands of acres.

Good Luck
Karen

[HorseMomToSage]

What about a young rescue? You could bypass the puppy stage and still end up with a very nice dog. We once transported an older GP to our rescue. She was about 8 and her owner just did not want her any more and was going to have her destroyed. I know there's one out there for you

[Sonseeahray's_girl]

Thanks all for your replies!

I will look into the Goat Herd lists and see if there's anything there. We really do want a younger dog, just so that we have as much time with it as possible, and let's face it, the pups are just so cute! We don't want to miss that fleeting stage.

We are not expecting our pup to guard anything at this point. His first job will be to bond with us and our horses, then he can learn to guard later on. Our horses did fine last winter with no LGD, and it was a long and bad one. And we're not planning on adding any other animals until next spring at the earliest. We also plan on getting an electric collar containment unit to train him where his boundaries are.

I think we'll be going with the litter that will be ready in November. Thanks again all for your advice and input!

[snwflk]

Some advice on the E-collar?- THEY DONT WORK WELL on PYRs just due to their funky necks-UNLESS You will have it pretty tight and you will need to shave a spot that the metal bars can touch the skin - Since their skin is loose around their necks, all they have to do is shake their head and the collar will move- You will have to double check it alot- just make sure that you can get at least 1-2 fingers between collar and dogs skin- I use a bark collar on mine sometimes and I have the exact problem- the shaving part works -because then it actually makes CONTACT with the dog-

Just some helpful advice - from one pyr owner to "ANOTHER" (soon to be anyways)

[leslie645]

I too have a Pyr. He 6 months old. My absolute main concern was for a healthy dog. I searched and found a breeder that breeds for health. Both my dogs parents OFA certified excellent. The breeders dogs are show quality. The info is http://www.great-pyrenees.net/index.html . The breeder is called heart livestock. I crossed checked my pups parents OFA certs on the OFA website. I found aLot of breeders that say they breed for health but their dogs are not ofa certified...

My pry is awesome. I cant say enough good things about him. I am very pleased. He is only 6 months old but his head is taller than my waist.

If you decide on a pry for a livestock guardian, do some research on how to properly train a pyrenees puppy. And what to expect from the breed.
I use a electric containment collar on mine. shaved a spot on his neck and hes totallly cool with it. Not a problem at all with Polar Bear dog.