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Old 05-06-2007, 07:48 PM  
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Breeding the young stallion???

OK, this is a strange question, and I am not sure if this si just me, or if anyone else out there is either having this problem or had this problem...My young stud came home from training last week, and I am tickled pink that he is home. i have ridden him a handful of times an dhe is awesome! Well my dilema, i have 2 mares I plan on breeding to him, these are my own mares. One came into heat day before yesterday, the other is actually leased out until next week as my friends daughter wanted to borrow her for trail riding. OK, I tie my mare, clean her up, wrap her tail, and I go get my boy, he assumes his duties to tease, adn he gets "hard", he mounts the mare, but cannot seem to find where his "friend" is supposed to go. If I go back there to help him out he is already letting his load out on her rear end and he is sliding off. He is aiming a few inches too low. Now unfortunately, he will tease but won't even get hard anymore. I even put the two in a smaller pen together and he again, will talk to her and even on a couple of occassions, he will get hard but after he is hard, he will stop talking and walk away. I am pretty sure he is frustrated as he is doing what he thinks he should do but cannot seem to get his "satisfaction".

Any suggestions? Sooner than later so I don't scald him from breeding in the future. Do I need ot call a friend in for a few of the sessions until he figures out what he is doing? Anyone else go through this?

Some stats incase you all what to know. My boy is a little over 14.2hands tall, the mare si ever so slightly shorter than he is. He is almost 3 (mid July) and she is 4. My other mare is 10 this year and that mare is 15hands even. The 4 year old that i have been trying to breed ties quietly and braces herself nicely, and does not kick. She does squeel when he nibbles too hard or she will swish her tail in his face pretty hard, but that is about it. I cannot think of anything ro any signals th emare is giving that is telling him not to breed her.
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Old 05-06-2007, 09:24 PM  
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He's still pretty young, just don't let him "over do it" if that makes any sense. Our stallion is much older then yours and we won't allow him to breed or try to breed more then 1 time per day, when he was younger he didn't get to NEAR that often either.

If it was me, I would seperate him from the mare for a day or so... Give him time to re think things and get his attention a little more. Then when the time comes, have a KNOWLEDGABLE friend help you with holding him while breeding, and you can "assist" him if need be. Be very careful though, it is VERY dangerous.

All in all, he's young, and probably still tryin to figure out what all is "going on' in the girl department.
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Old 05-06-2007, 10:41 PM  
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I agree you need help from a friend. I would have taken him back to his stall or whatever and let him cool down then try later. While wearing a helmet and having your friends help you can guide his penis into the mare once he mounts be carefull not to get trampled in the process. Once they actualy get in they usualy can take it from there. It may take a few trys before he gets the idea. It took one of my studs a few times before he got the whole thing down pat. Another thing about it he may jump the mare and enter her and look like he ejaculated but he may not the first few times. check out the site equine-reproduction.com they have lots of information about breeding even a chat area for these sort of problems.
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Old 05-06-2007, 10:57 PM  
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I contacted a friend of mine tonight, she is a backyard horse owner and she would never think of breeding horses, and she lives 40 miles away, she said she would come help me, and unfortunataly, she is my ONLY friend closest to me to help, everyone else that I know with stallions (literally only 2 friends) one lives about an hour away and she pasture breeds only so would be of no help and the other is multiple hours away. I have handled stallions before, but they all knew what they were doing, I am talking 10+ year old stallions. I have never had one myself, but managed the stallion and mare barns at my old job. And even there, i have never worked with one so young that didn't know what he was doing. I have owned this stallion since he was 2 months old and he was weaned at 4-5 months and I have had him in my care since he was weaned, except for the 4 1/2 months he was gone for training. I know him VERY well and I trust him and know he will not hurt me, at least not intentionally.

One question, how do I go about "helping" him when my friend is here helping me? Should she stand at my mare's head and hold the leadrope, if so does the leadrope need to be fairly slack or not slack to help him brace, while I help in him the insertion part?? I figured he would figure out what he was doing once it was in, adn again after a few help sessions I figured he would know what to do. he only teases about once a day, I did twice a few days ago under the eye of my vet as I have a mare booked to an outside stud that is in heat but not ovulating and he told me to tease her so it might get her to ovulate so she can go back to the other stallion, but besides that, he only gets that one other mare. he is currently running the pasture with a majority of my mares right now as I have that one in heat mare and a mare I am selling (supposed toleave in the morning) inhis pen so they won't get covered if he decides to "know" what to do in the middle of the night. And I cannot get water to the round pen, hoses don't reach that far.

I will check out that website!
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Old 05-07-2007, 03:57 AM  
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You sometimes have to "guide" him to the spot And be prepared for him to faint or be wobbly after his first successful encounter... We offered Joe a ciggerette (he declined)...
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Old 05-07-2007, 07:20 AM  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gbarmranch
You sometimes have to "guide" him to the spot And be prepared for him to faint or be wobbly after his first successful encounter... We offered Joe a ciggerette (he declined)...


Oh! that one mad my sides hurt I'm laughing so hard! Thanks gbar!
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Old 05-07-2007, 09:24 AM  
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Here is how I bred my stallion who was only 2.5 years old his first time. (he will be 3 next month).

It was his first time as well as the mare's! I dont recommend that for everyone.

I teased like crazy to be sure Dixie was totally receptive and Zippy would behave himself. First tease across a sturdy fence, then brought him in but didnt allow him to go any farther back than her shoulder.

Once she was totally receptive (mind you she is tied as I am the only one here that can really handle the horses), I allowed Zippy to "creep" past her shoulder. If he tried to mount too early, he was made to back off and get away from her. I didnt want her to get scared being her first time, and him to be a "rusher". Anyways, once we actually got back there, she did try to tuck her tail some (she was a little scared). So while I held Zip's lead in my left hand, I used my right to move her tail. Zip was a tad clumsy at first so I did have to "guide him" the first time (Dixie is short too, only 14h).

Anyways Zip was no different after his first time. Didnt get weak, tired, etc. I did this whole process each time he covered a mare.

When I let him breed Shawnee (16h) he had no trouble finding the spot and I even allowed him to "pasture breed" her. No problem that way either.

Here are my thoughts on why your stallion is not breeding successfully:
1. mare is not actually ready
2. he is not mentally/physically ready

When your friend gets there, have her handle the mare. YOU handle your stallion, as you know him best. I never allow anyone but myself and my trainer handle Zippy no matter how well behaved he is. Once he is up there, grab the mare's tail if its in the way to move it. If he cant seem to get there, help him out. Once he gets it that first time the other times come easily. Be sure he ejaculates in the mare and doesnt dismount too early. Zip did that the first time around.

Brittany
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Old 05-07-2007, 09:53 AM  
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SOMETIMES...

YA GOTTA TAKE MATTERS INTO YOUR OWN HANDS
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Old 05-07-2007, 09:59 AM  
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As everyone else said, just give it time...


Tigers first time was so funny, he tried to breed everything but the butt including her ear. So, funny 9 years later he would breed a fence post if I said "Let's go, up"

All you can do is find a really easy breeding mare and give it a few tries. Some stallions need to mature a little. I also helps to let the first encounters be really low key, don't try to get manners or rush things with a youngster.

Six Gun is 25 months and he has just realized that mares smell really good.

Banner is 13 months I cannot get him to leave the mares alone. He needs some time in Dad's paddock to see where he belongs until he is gelded (fall we want a lot of jaw on that colt).He is ready to breed now if he could convince the mares to get in a ditch
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Old 05-07-2007, 03:37 PM  
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We actually had three people for Sierras "first time". A friend held the mare who was very experienced and definately ready. I held Sierra's head/leadrope and Amanda got to be the "helping hand".

If you can only have 2 people, have your friend hold the mare and you hold the stallion and be the helping hand. I agree with only letting him "try" once a day. You don't want him to get too frustrated, or he won't be any good later.

Good luck.
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Old 05-07-2007, 03:41 PM  
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Thank you, i will try this tomorrow if I can get my friend out then. I have him away from the ladies completely, so he should be more than ready tomorrow. If he seems to talk a lot tonight I could try tonight, but I highly doubt my husband would be willing to help. I am pretty much the only one in my household and even in my neighborhood with horses, and no one near me has a stallion, at least no one I know anyways.
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Old 05-07-2007, 03:50 PM  
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Old 05-07-2007, 04:02 PM  
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One of my studs first times was very similar to the situation you are having now. So just keep trying he will get the hang of it.They scramble around trying to figure out where to put it. Some try to mount the mare from any direction. Sounds like he is at least jumping the right end. As for who should hold what horse. You hold your stallion let your friend hold the mare, make shure shes wearing a helmet also. If you dont have anyone to help you you can tie the mare but make shure the tie spot is safe and away from any possible entanglement (if she is tied so she cannot move at all she could get injured inside from the stallion, if he is to long for her birth canal). I have used a ring that was screwed into the arena wall that i placed a lung line through and had someone hold the end That way the mare wasnt tied and could move some but still held in place. Just in case the stallion somehow got tangled in it I would be able to just let out slack on the lunge line. The mare handler was also at a safe distance as not to get injured by the mare if she freaked.
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Old 05-08-2007, 11:22 AM  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ron
SOMETIMES...

YA GOTTA TAKE MATTERS INTO YOUR OWN HANDS

But This is so true.


He a young stallion, He going to need guidance - you know what I mean.
Where protective clothes and head gear just in case.
catchers mitt, and a turkey baster if all else fells.
Ah, just kidding, but I have been their with our young stallions, who, could never get the right end, and by the time he got around to the right end, it was all to late. Some mare will not tolerate it either. My husband mare was getting mad, and never has been a kicker, she did kick out and got my husband cell phone. Broke it, thank god it was the cell phone and not something else.
On a more serious note, please have someone help you and please be careful. it can be dangerous, no matter how calm your stallion might be..
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Old 05-08-2007, 11:35 AM  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Deanna
One of my studs first times was very similar to the situation you are having now. So just keep trying he will get the hang of it.They scramble around trying to figure out where to put it. Some try to mount the mare from any direction. Sounds like he is at least jumping the right end. As for who should hold what horse. You hold your stallion let your friend hold the mare, make shure shes wearing a helmet also. If you dont have anyone to help you you can tie the mare but make shure the tie spot is safe and away from any possible entanglement (if she is tied so she cannot move at all she could get injured inside from the stallion, if he is to long for her birth canal). I have used a ring that was screwed into the arena wall that i placed a lung line through and had someone hold the end That way the mare wasnt tied and could move some but still held in place. Just in case the stallion somehow got tangled in it I would be able to just let out slack on the lunge line. The mare handler was also at a safe distance as not to get injured by the mare if she freaked.
I had to laugh at this one. Another one of Sierra's first attempts, we decided to let him pasture breed (or attempt to anyway) because for the most part he was very gentle. Well, he jumped on the wrong end and poked the poor mare in the eye!! After we picked ourselves up off the ground from laughing, we decided a little help was in order. Thank goodness he is much more experienced now, and doesn't need any help. Of course we still have Twister (our stallion prospect) who will need help in a couple of years.
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Old 05-08-2007, 11:40 AM  
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We breed our mares in the roundpen.

I bring the mare in the roundpen and my husband has our stallion on the other side. I put the leadrope through the rail and I go on the "outside" of the roundpen and hold the mare. My husband is in complete control of our stallion and I'm out of harms way.

This works best for us.
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Old 05-08-2007, 11:42 AM  
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LOL, I am still laughing at some of these stories!! At least he knows what end to jump on, lol. He is very much talking to the ladies this morning. i took onemare to the vet this morning, an older mare, who I have booked to an outside stallion, long story short this heat cycle she has had no follicle. Well today she had 2 very tiny ones and the vet said let them be and do not take her to the stud the end of this cycle to wait until the next one, that way she regulates herself. LOL, he was talking up a storm, but when it came to sniffing the mare, I have ot go through his pen to get to the pasture, he was talking with a mouthful of hay!! He would not stop eating to even sniff her, lol. Talking about his priorities. My friend is still sleeping so I will wait about another hour and I will wake her rear end up!! Hopefully before it gets way too hot out this afternoon we can get this done, or maybe as the sun is going down. There should be a high of 90 today!
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Old 05-09-2007, 01:08 PM  
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Yeah......those suggestions......did not work. It did not help that my friend who came out couldn't even keep my mare standing still, keep in mind, that mare, is a 20 year old DEAD BROKE mare that will literally stand still and not move at all if you put her somewhere and tell her whoa. I was amazed at the fact that she couldn't handle that little, old mare! Needless to say, Wylie didn't even get close enough to get a good tease! My friend was complaining the whole time about "the stupid mare".

I called into my friend in Selah, who likes to make day trips, and she said she would be more than happy to help me with him, and she is hoping to drive out here tonight, but she has not called me yet so who knows if she is coming out today. She said she went through this with her stallion 3 years ago and she is going to handle Wylie while I hold my mare. She had a theory that Wylie slides off the mare when you go to his side not because he is confused, but because he has enough respect for humans to not do this stuff on the halter. he has been raised since he was weaned and came home to live with me, that halter, and any other tack, means NO TALK and no actions. He stands tied to the trailer, fence, whereever, and will even trailer with a mare and he won't say a word, and now all of a sudden I am telling him it is OK an dhe is confused by that and the fact that he cannot figure out what he is doing. if this is true as her theory, i feel bad for him, he is probably way more confused than I am!!

Anyways, Thought i would give this update, and let you all know I am still trying to figure it out.
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Old 05-09-2007, 02:18 PM  
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We use a 10 foot lead and a CA halter with Joe - it lets him move around the mare to a point, but also lets Pat control him..

Good luck and keep us updated.. Those first times can be pretty comical
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Old 05-09-2007, 03:22 PM  
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I think most people have ONE specific halter they use when breeding, the halter means, Ok, it's time to "do the dance" and if they aren't wearing it, then that means better "keep the snake in the pants"...

Make any sense?

Gee, I'm a poet and didn't even know it,

I might rhyme for a second time! ( Ok, I'll stop now)
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